Joomla

[Mykhal]

Hi

I am wondering if it is worth the trouble to learn Joomla?

I am not into Web Design, but I saw on their website that it is a "content managenent system"! Now this sounds interesting to me, as I have been playing with the idea of developing an online reference program/database of all my programming reference works and manuals (for most I do have PDF files).

Is it worth to look at Joomla, taking into account that I will have to invest some time to get to know it. Will it be worth it? How difficult is it?

[Anthro]

ALOT, of it is point click, add modules / components. Very good to learn with and..it's free. !

[Stuart]

Nice knowledge to have, but it depends what you want to do. There are easier CMSes out there, which may be better for you if you don't need something horribly versatile. The vast majority of people I've known who've wanted to try to learn Joomla have given up before very long. It's a bit of a learning curve, so if you're going to try you have to be convinced you want to do it. As Anthro says, it's actually not that hard, once you get a basic understanding of how the system works. It's getting the basic understanding that most people give up on.

[Mykhal]

Thanx Anthro -then another question: Will it be best to use it under Linux or Windows? How difficult is it to upload a website? (My cousing is willing to host a website for me for free, but I am not sure if he uses Joomla. I assume it must be installed on his server(s)?

[Mykhal]

Stuart - What type of understanding do you mean? I am quite fluent in "normal" programming, so it is just the HTML stuff that will be new to me. Can you give me examples of other CMSs that is also free?

Why I am thinking about Joomla is that I can kill two birds with one stone - my own website, and a CMS!

[Jonboy]

There are easier CMSes out there, which may be better for you if you don't need something horribly versatile.

Which CMSes are you referring to Stu? Are they also free like Joomla? I've started dabbling in Joomla but it goes over and above what I need from our website.

[Anthro]

Proper ISP servers, is a point and click install of Joomla, as it is a predefined component of many hosting providers.
I am sure installing it on linux would be a better option, stability etc.

Failed to mention the learning curve, personally I enjoyed the ease of use of the 'bog standard template' - and it can be spotted a mile away by the way
But there are many add ons, which provide nifty functionality, galleries etc.

[hamin_aus]

Which CMSes are you referring to Stu?

The Nukes maybe?

ASPNuke, PHPNuke, DotNetNuke

[Stuart]

Stuart - What type of understanding do you mean? I am quite fluent in "normal" programming, so it is just the HTML stuff that will be new to me. Can you give me examples of other CMSs that is also free?

Why I am thinking about Joomla is that I can kill two birds with one stone - my own website, and a CMS!

Others include Wordpress, Blogger, Drupal. They all seem a little easier to me. I don't particularly like Blogger. Wordpress is nice for a simple site. The increasing support for widgets makes it quite versatile too. Drupal is rather popular among the CMS crowd. Many people have great dislike for Joomla and punt Drupal instead. I prefer Joomla myself, but I must say that Drupal would probably be easier to learn.

The understanding I am talking about is the basic structure of Joomla. You get Sections, Categories and Content. In my experience, people seem to struggle to get their mind around this. Content is what is actually displayed. Content must be placed within a Category, which must be placed within a Section, so you have to give some thought to how things are laid out. It's quite simple once you get it under your belt, but I've known far too many people who give up before they've given it a good go.

You also then have to understand module positions, know where to place things, understand what module positions have which limitations, etc. I guess this would be the same in any CMS, however.

Again, it's really not hard once you get into it, but you have to be committed to getting into it or you're going to end up giving up.

[doo_much]

but I've known far too many people who give up before they've given it a good go.

---snip---

Again, it's really not hard once you get into it, but you have to be committed to getting into it or you're going to end up giving up.

I'm more of a Security type than an IT type and I had my first webpage running in a day?

I'd give you all the link but then I'd have to demand you click one of my Google ADS!

[doo_much]

Stuart - What type of understanding do you mean? I am quite fluent in "normal" programming, so it is just the HTML stuff that will be new to me. Can you give me examples of other CMSs that is also free?

Why I am thinking about Joomla is that I can kill two birds with one stone - my own website, and a CMS!

Have a look here for some alternatives!

But yes, I'm aJoomla fanboi. There's lots of free modules etc that you can load to do whatever - and it is Open Source so mucking about with something more in-depth is also possible. Although I've heard complaints that Joomla sites tend to be a bit slower than some...

Get yourself MovAmp and run it in a standalone server to start off with. You won't be sorry!

[Anakha56]

Wow that MovAmp looks brilliant! Thanks doo .

My only problem with Joomla is that there is no easy access control option, one where you can assign certain users to update certain modules. There is meant to be a big upgrade coming for Joomla for access control but I have been waiting a year now for it and it still seems to be no closer to being released . If that version could get released then I could get our site live but until then no access control no site...

[Mykhal]

Doo - but its French!

[Anakha56]

Meh once you get the click here and here and here approach down pat it wont matter . Thanks for pointing out its in French, will wait until doo gives us the English version...

[KALSTER]

I have been playing around with Joomla that I set up with a cheap international hosting provider just to see what it is all about. Since then I have bought a nice template with Virtuemart integration and it isn't that difficult. I plan to move it to a South African hosting company (probably Hetzner) with a new domain name before I announce it. You can also find a few PDF's that can guide you with basic customization to more advanced tweaking. Installing Joomla is a breeze with the Fantastico scripts a lot of hosting companies have available. I don't have anything to compare it to though, but to me it doesn't look too complicated.

[Stuart]

More user groups and better access control have been requested features in Joomla for years now.

[doo_much]

Wow that MovAmp looks brilliant! Thanks doo .

My only problem with Joomla is that there is no easy access control option, one where you can assign certain users to update certain modules. There is meant to be a big upgrade coming for Joomla for access control but I have been waiting a year now for it and it still seems to be no closer to being released . If that version could get released then I could get our site live but until then no access control no site...

Or even Access to only certain Sections/Category. I agree. So be nice and write us a module that does it!

Doo - but its French!

Meh once you get the click here and here and here approach down pat it wont matter . Thanks for pointing out its in French, will wait until doo gives us the English version...

I could help you guys at a charge or show you the easy way... ? No wait, I charge beers/hour!

More user groups and better access control have been requested features in Joomla for years now.

There are 'paid for' Modules that do it.

[doo_much]

I have been playing around with Joomla that I set up with a cheap international hosting provider just to see what it is all about. Since then I have bought a nice template with Virtuemart integration and it isn't that difficult. I plan to move it to a South African hosting company (probably Hetzner) with a new domain name before I announce it. You can also find a few PDF's that can guide you with basic customization to more advanced tweaking. Installing Joomla is a breeze with the Fantastico scripts a lot of hosting companies have available. I don't have anything to compare it to though, but to me it doesn't look too complicated.

You bought a template with Virtuemart? Linky? That money was just burning a hole in your pocket wasn't it?
You don't need any scripts to install Joomla? I just use weasel for hosting. His servers are local and although he isn't the cheapest his aftersales service is excellent.


I know - he dried my nappies through my first Joomla site!

[Anakha56]

Or even Access to only certain Sections/Category. I agree. So be nice and write us a module that does it!

I wouldnt know where to start . I am not a programmer and have only basic HTML skills .

[KALSTER]

You bought a template with Virtuemart? Linky? That money was just burning a hole in your pocket wasn't it?

Yeah, I know you can get Virtuemart for free, but I bought the template for how it looks and what it offers. It looks cool and professional and I haven't seen anyone else use it thus far. It is a Rockettheme. My site is a shambles at the moment with a plain logo and demo content all over the place, so I'd rather not show anyone what it looks like just yet, if you don't mind.

You don't need any scripts to install Joomla?

Surprisingly, I know this too, but with the Fantastico script it is just a few clicks to get it up and running. No FTP'ing or anything. Oh, and its free. I don't want to give Weasel bad press, but he charges quite a lot just to install Joomla for you.

[Stuart]

There are 'paid for' Modules that do it.

I'm aware of that, but I am VERY selective with commercial components, modules and plugins for Joomla. Plus I don't really like the way any of them work. I'd like to see the Joomla team offer it as part of the core package. There have been requests for it for long enough.

Surprisingly, I know this too, but with the Fantastico script it is just a few clicks to get it up and running. No FTP'ing or anything. Oh, and its free. I don't want to give Weasel bad press, but he charges quite a lot just to install Joomla for you.

Manual installation of Joomla is a pain compared to Fantastico. I have unfortunately dealt with some hosts that don't provide Fantastico, so I've had to do the manual installation several times. I prefer Fantastico.

[KALSTER]

Manual installation of Joomla is a pain compared to Fantastico. I have unfortunately dealt with some hosts that don't provide Fantastico, so I've had to do the manual installation several times. I prefer Fantastico.

Agreed, though, come to think of it, I removed my initial Joomla installation to run the installation with the template integrated. Not sure if it works differently than normal Joomla installation (don't think so), but I was able to do it even with my virtually non-existent knowledge. Still much more hasslesome than with Fantastico though.

[doo_much]

You don't need any scripts to install Joomla?

Surprisingly, I know this too, but with the Fantastico script it is just a few clicks to get it up and running. No FTP'ing or anything. Oh, and its free. I don't want to give Weasel bad press, but he charges quite a lot just to install Joomla for you.

Right - so it seems I need to explore Fantastico...

Although I haven't had any issues installing any of the 6 websites I've done recently. Each unto his own i guess?

And give weasel a lot of bad press - he doesn't spend enough time here to claim 'Forumite Rights'!

Manual installation of Joomla is a pain compared to Fantastico. I have unfortunately dealt with some hosts that don't provide Fantastico, so I've had to do the manual installation several times. I prefer Fantastico.

I'll give Fantastico a try.

What issues hav eyou had with the installation though?

[doo_much]

And on the subject.

Has anyone EVER had any joy out of Joomla Remote?

IMHO it is quite 'dubbel k-middel a'.


But I haven't been able to find anything else with similar capability.

[Stuart]

What issues hav eyou had with the installation though?

Not issues as such. Just takes longer to upload it, etc. With Joomla 1.0.x it was a REAL pain because then you had to go back in your FTP client and change permissions for a bunch of files and folders, and then sometimes when you installed add-ons you'd also have to change permissions. They seem to at least have sorted that out for the most part with Joomla 1.5.

My biggest gripe with Joomla so far was that there was no simple, Joomla-certified way to update your site from 1.0 to 1.5. We have a LOT of content on our church website, and it took me MONTHS to figure out how to successfully transfer content across. I sincerely hope that they're not going to make the same mistake when they release 2.0.

On another note, I've been surprised to see how long 1.5.15 has lasted without a security update. Either they did a really good job of it or they are not updating like they should. In the past, updates have been rather frequent. But this particular release has stayed current for a long time now.