Pricing and Stuff in the Mag

Heavysmoker · Post by **Heavysmoker** » 09 Jul 2009, 22:32

Hey There guys

Just a quick one, enjoy the mag but find that there are a few things that i find that are not really needed in the mag.

Firstly lets just say that I work in a retail shop, and that when people come in, they start asking for the PRICE on hardware as is stated in the Mag, please as a suggestion, to remove this as it really makes a huge difference when trying to sell to the end user. I for one know that Hardware is not cheap, but find that the pricing in the mag can be very decieving as alot of people forget that pricing fluctuates also to the RoE (Rate of Exchange). Please if posting pricing, then rather start stating that a RRP is between Amount and Amount. I know that the guys from PCF get sponsored alot of the stuff from suppliers, and therefore add a markup that is not usually anything substantial.

The reason why I am typing this out is that it gets frusttrating when someone walks in and says, BUT PCF has it at this price.

Also, being suggestions, to help out on the mag, such as this months issue, Win XP, Vista and Win7, i understand that it was either a Beta or RC package, but trying to compare Win7 to all the others before the final release or official release doesnt help. As most of the general public will read that article and not finish it, they look at the benchmarks. when looking at the Bench's, it is saying to the public that Win7 is not any better. Although it is a Beta or RC pack. People dont read all that. In the end people will start turning around and say well, if it performs worse than vista or slower, they wont buy it. My suggestion on that, coz RC is not fully workable anyway, but it is the closest that you can get before the official release date which is 22 October, however rather test Win7 when it is released, much better than any beta or RC anyway.

These are my 2 cents worth.

Thanks

Post by **KillerByte** » 10 Jul 2009, 06:47

Hi

When I source prices of components the first thing I do is phone up the supplier and ask for a RRP. If the supplier does not get back to me in time I then go to reputable online retailers like DigitalSAOnline and LandMarkPC to get real world prices. In fact I usually double check the prices on these and other sites to make sure the RRP is not too low or too high.
Price is an important aspect of a review and to omit it would be against our readers' best interests.

With regards to your Win 7 complaint. The majority of our readers are computer enthusiasts and they want to know what the performance figures of Windows 7 is in comparision to the other OSes.

Regards

Michael Reed

Tribble · Post by **Tribble** » 10 Jul 2009, 06:55

I agree - we like to know the prices. It doesn't make sense for us to read a review in the mag and then go looking for the price on the net - we like them both in the same place. And most people know that online prices are less than store prices, as there are a whole lot of other factors like rent that affects the price.

Jonboy · Post by **Jonboy** » 10 Jul 2009, 07:25

I agree, the majority of reader's are probably consumers and not retailers and thus to omit the pricing to save retailers some grief is not best practice in my opinion. It also comes across as quite deceptive by retailers to make this sort of request because I find that many retailers have astronomical markups on items that can be bought for much less. Take for example my 9800GT 1Gb graphics card. I bought this in December last year. The regular retailers (physical PC shops) wanted around R2700 for this until I pointed out that the if they don't make a plan, I'll get it from an online retailer where the price is R1800. Needless to say they dropped the price!

The one thing I can point out with this month's mag. There's a headline on the cover and a note within the article that mentions AMD's Supercomputer for R1600... "Do you only have R1600 for a PC"? Unless I'm being a total charlie, the price of an ATI 4770 was R1600, there was no other mention of CPUs, RAM, mobos etc in that article?

Post by **Anakha56** » 10 Jul 2009, 07:48

Jonboy I agree with the misleading title, I read it and started to looking for the rest of the article. Realized it was no there and decided to ignore it...

I think K/B's explanation on pricing explains it sufficiently but maybe a new legend is in order? If you have a price from a supplier it is RRP, if you get it from a online store maybe ORP? Just a thought...

Firestrm_ZA · Post by **Firestrm_ZA** » 10 Jul 2009, 08:05

Just to add to Anakha's little blurb here..... top right of the cover goes on about switching to linux and being able to boot faster and you can play games? Yet theres no article in the mag about linux as described?

Only a install ubuntu/kubuntu article and a tiny little block on WINE usage in linux

another misleading sellpoint.... cmon guys i buy PCF religiously every month, and frankly i was quite excited to see linux desribed as such... only to be let down by this.... anyone else feel cheated here?

SykomantiS · Post by **SykomantiS** » 10 Jul 2009, 08:10

Hi, first of all: Welcome to the forums.

Suggested reading:
Frequently asked questions
Posting Guidelines (contains link to forum rules)

And then introduce yourself here.

Then secondly, not to insult you or accuse you of anything, but if the pricing is such a problem then you have either one of two problems: the wrong suppliers, or too much markup (or both).

The pricing in the mag is usually spot on or often times very near real world pricing, for both on and offline retailers.

As for the Win7 issue, although I haven't read the mag (Belgium don't have them SA PCFormats over here

) I for one can vouch that even the first beta is way better than Vista, and in my opinion even better than XP. The benchies may be the same, but you can't quantify the experience of using the OS, even in beta form.

Heavysmoker · Post by **Heavysmoker** » 10 Jul 2009, 12:59

Hi Guys

Thanks for the replies, but however some have missed the point. The thing is this, I do work in a retail store, yes the overheads are alot more than online, but however i can personally tell you what the average markup is for an online store, and what it is for a retail store. There is usually not much of a difference on the prices, unless the retail store is seriously trying to make a quick buck. I work for a company that is very well established, and our markups are not that high.

So coming back down to pricing, there is a huge difference when phoning a supplier, such as Rectron for Gigabyte hardware, please note that they are the sole distributors in SA for gigabyte, how can they give a RRP when everyone in retail stores get different prices, wont mension names, but bulk buying is a big player. But also it is not in the end users best interest to phone them for a pricing, as this is generally a cost price. Incl VAT. needless to say, how am i supposed to give a pricing, competitively if they give a pricing.

Please note that if you have never worked in a Retail computer store, you seriously wont understand what this means. But if you are in Sales, this should make sense, as everyone is out to make a living. Just remember, that if a supplier brings something in at a cost price, there is their markup, Shipping costs, Customs, etc. Before it really gets to the us in a store. from that we add our markup, which is in general not that much. So to complicate things, people want discounts, which we will give, if at all possible.

Please just check on what I have said, im not saying that it is a good or a bad idea. but instead of phoning suppliers, which they dont know what the RRP is, check online rather or phone a reputable retailer. Coz Suppliers really dont know what type of markups are in a store.

Thanks

Sojourn · Post by **Sojourn** » 10 Jul 2009, 13:23

The misdirected misleading Linux to play games threw me a bit. -1
I had a look at Jonboy's R1600 PC in the mag now... that is also a stuff-up from them, you are not a Charlie. -1

As for general pricing and Win 7, what Michael said.

Post by **Anakha56** » 10 Jul 2009, 13:30

Heavy just out of interest sake how much would a Gigabyte 4850 set us back by using your store? I just want to see the difference between three local online stores. Will post the difference after seeing your price.

Just so we get the right card:

Gigabyte® ATI® Radeon HD4850, 512MB 256Bit GDDR3, Dual DVI & TV-O
[A1_GV-R485ZL-512H]

Post by **KillerByte** » 10 Jul 2009, 13:34

The suppliers usually give a price that is equal to what a retailer will pay to get the component from the supplier plus a 10% markup.

Post by **Stuart** » 10 Jul 2009, 13:35

I'm with Anakha. Give us an example or two of faulty pricing schemes in the PCF mag and let's see what you're talking about here.

rustypup · Post by **rustypup** » 10 Jul 2009, 13:47

KillerByte wrote:what a retailer will pay to get the component from the supplier plus a 10% markup.

surely you jest... 10% doesn't even cover rent and staff, in most cases... what retailer, (offline), in this world survives on a 10% GP?... or even 40%?

not to mention what happens to the bottom line when the RoE plays hopscotch... suddenly, your 10% is actually -3% and you'd make more money burning product than selling it...

Post by **KillerByte** » 10 Jul 2009, 13:55

well the number varies from supplier to supplier. I still compare the price to the local online retailers to make sure it is within an acceptable margin.

Heavysmoker · Post by **Heavysmoker** » 10 Jul 2009, 13:57

Out of the interest as requested, i would retail it at R2689 incl VAT.

but back to killerbyte, how do they mark it up at 10%, how do they know what is the general markup of stuff in stores. I would gladly say that if it were true, i wouldnt have a problem, but it isnt true.

w1z4rd911 · Post by **w1z4rd911** » 10 Jul 2009, 14:01

Ok, Howzit okes.

I buy PCF every month religiously and have done so from issue #2 way back when payphones were still the only mobile phone around

Please take my ranting without offense, just my bit of peanut butter from the peanut gallery

With regards to the Win7 Article, although the benchies etc in some cases were lower than Vista or XP, it does stipulate that it is a Beta version and at the end it does say not to make judgement until the official release. At the moment there is so much hype about Win7 that it is going to be better than Vista etc. And in many cases it is. It has been built from the ground up. There has been a (I stand for correction) 2 beta releases and now the RC is out, there has been extensive realworld testing on it and suggestions to make it better which M$ never did with Vista. I still don't like Vista and would rather use Ubuntu (if I could use Linux properly - hence the thread I dropped in about PCF doing a howto guide for beginners) or XP. XP when it came out was buggy, not very nice to work with but look at it now. Give M$ time and more than likely performance out of Win7 will be better than Vista. My step-Bro says it needs SP1 before buying but I disagree and as soon as I have cash and a decent machine I will definately put it on. Also heavysmoker, if you have real world experience with Beta code (ie. Battlefield Heroes, Win7, Mozzilla apps) you will see that Beta is not optimised as yet and is generally slower than final release. Most people who buy PCF normally buy 2 - 3 mags before making up their minds about buying stuff, SACM, NAG, etc. I buy them all so I can make an informed decision on what to buy and not to buy. Also an Article is generally an opinion in time. Have a look around on the net for Win7 tests and a lot of them represent what was written in PCF at the time. Win 7 RC is apparently a bit quicker on 32 bit than the Beta code was.

Also, PCF, does a lot of work to get the correct info before deadline of going to print but they are also human and typo's do happen now and then, and I have been caught out with a few things as well (can you say "April fool" - Larrabee).
I understand retailers problems with pricing at times, but, I have caught some retailer out as well and got good pricing on stuff before after fighting for it. We all need to vote for better quality products and pricing with our wallets - just look at Makro and Game over Xmas time with the old stock the sell for next to nothing and catch ppl out with pricing, take the Lappy or desktop to little Timmy and he aint happy coz it was top of the line during the great flood of Noah's time.

Thanks for listening to me jump up and down and hopefully no offence to any one.

PCF- I love your mag, keep up the good work

Ciao

Post by **Anakha56** » 10 Jul 2009, 14:08

Not bad, www.prophecy.co.za has it for:

R2597.90

With free shipping.

www.digitalsaonline.co.za:

R2,461.26

Shipping: is dependant on weight but should take it to Prophecy's price.

/landmarkpc.co.za is taking forever to load...

Heavysmoker · Post by **Heavysmoker** » 10 Jul 2009, 14:09

on top of all of this, needless to say, a distributor such as rectron, is not really allowed by law to actually give a price from their price list to the public. But still not equating to a 10% margin. I totally agree on what Rustypup had to say, as this plays big roles in pricing. Do the Math.

Heavysmoker · Post by **Heavysmoker** » 10 Jul 2009, 14:13

Anakha56 wrote:Not bad, http://www.prophecy.co.za has it for:

R2597.90
With free shipping.

http://www.digitalsaonline.co.za:

R2,461.26
Shipping: is dependant on weight but should take it to Prophecy's price.

/landmarkpc.co.za is taking forever to load...

Fine on this, but however, yes it is online that you are getting pricing. But remember that i am in a full retail store. not online. Therefore shipping it out would cost maybe the same as what i am selling it at. But if you then go to the Mag, PCF would probably put in a pricing of R2399 incl VAT, this is not exactly what we wont be selling it at, but it is bnow stipulated as that. then you get people walking in asking for that price. How do you compare that price anywhere.

Post by **Anakha56** » 10 Jul 2009, 14:14

www.landmarkpc.co.za:

R2506.86

Again shipping is determined by weight. So you are pricing roughly the same as 3 online stores.

Post by **Stuart** » 10 Jul 2009, 14:14

Edit: Nvm.

Sojourn · Post by **Sojourn** » 10 Jul 2009, 17:49

Pricing issues: ?? Nothing to see here, move on.

Mayhaps tell your customers that you are a re-seller which by definition implies they will be ripped off and that they have to make peace with the fact and either buy it at that price or move on.

w1z4rd911 · Post by **w1z4rd911** » 10 Jul 2009, 21:37

Sojourn wrote:Pricing issues: ?? Nothing to see here, move on.

Mayhaps tell your customers that you are a re-seller which by definition implies they will be ripped off and that they have to make peace with the fact and either buy it at that price or move on.

@sojourn

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

pmsl, lmao

Thanks I needed that

Prime · Post by **Prime** » 10 Jul 2009, 22:08

Heavysmoker, Do you ever have stuff that actually goes for lower than printed in PCF.

if the chain you belong to is as big as you say it is, perhaps you should rather be trying to get in touch with PCf and let them bounce prices off you on occassion.

But you are competing for the enthusiast market, and We vote with our wallets. We also vote on customer service. And frankly, there is nothing I hate more than the poor service and ignorance I have come to experience from IC amongst others as well as their high prices.

I don't know what else to say

Heavysmoker · Post by **Heavysmoker** » 10 Jul 2009, 23:01

Hi there Prime,

I posted earlier that the pricing in a PCF mag is way lower than it should be, coz hey say 10% margin on the stuff. Therfore how are we supposed to be cheaper than what is in the mag?? Most of the time it is a cost plus vat. And that gives the general public a cost price, excluding our markup. What this all comes down to, is why are they putting in pricing that is not a real time pricing. Forget that the pricing can change from going to print. However it is still not a valid pricing on the stuff.

Please check it out, and you will understand what i am saying. How can they put in a pricing that is at COST. most of the time. PCF prices are what the Distributor is selling it at to the retailer, then how is the retailer expected to make a profit??? if they sell it at the same price as the distributor, coz if that is the case, then retailers will go out of business, which means that the general public can no longer buy their hardware, coz a distributor may not sell to the public. I understand that everyone is looking for better pricing, but it still does not justify that the pricing advertised is at COST. Then PCF should put in that a RRP is Price to Price depending on store, this is my whole issue on this.

It is a very price sensitive market at the moment due to recession, but still down to the same point, PCF is showing the Distributor Prices and not retail prices.

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