Let's pay more for petrol...

[Spicy-McHaggis]

THE TAX ON all fuel should be increased by at least 630c/litre to 750c. That will push the Gauteng price of 93 octane fuel and diesel up to at least R13/litre. In exchange for this, Finance Minister Trevor Manuel can do away completely with the current 14% VAT on all other products.

this might be able to work...

Source

Once again, this shouldn't mean any sleepless nights for CEOs in the motor industry.

[Hman]

That sounds like a plan, a crap one, but a plan none the less.

[Slasher]

Yip. So people working far from home go bankrupt and the others thrive? Imagine the price of a bus ticket or taxi fare should that become reality...

Why not up VAT and drop fuel tax?

[lancelot]

Indeed I feel strongly that the petrol price be deregulated as diesel is. That way we will have pumps competing for clients. Regarding VAT, they should raise it to 15% and take away VAT on essentials.

[Cameron_Losco]

Increase the price of petrol and killing VAT is a dumb idea.
I would rather have them up VAT and decrease the price of fuel or maybe income tax. That way the gov will be able to collect more from the guys that don't pay tax. They could even add a special tax to very expensive luxury purchases.

[SBSP]

I wish petrol was finished by now.

So this petrol problem can come to an end.
This would force people to come up with new fuel ideas like hydrogen.
or some fuel type that can be used in a standard car.

we would probably not even have to depend on other countries to
supply us with fuel.

[Hex_Rated]

I wish petrol was finished by now.

So this petrol problem can come to an end.
This would force people to come up with new fuel ideas like hydrogen.
or some fuel type that can be used in a standard car.

we would probably not even have to depend on other countries to
supply us with fuel.

Petrochemicals are used to make fertilizers. If we ran out of petrol, billions would starve. The reason petrol is used for propulsion is not because we can't find another fuel, it's only because its cheaper to use petrol than H2, fuel cells etc.

[Hman]

Ethanol is not expensive.

[Hex_Rated]

The technology needed to use it as a fuel in place of petrol is still more expensive AFAIK... And to retrofit or replace all vehicles with ethanol burning engines would be very expensive.

[SBSP]

Well if you think of it, Oil is used not only in fuel.

I'm sure oil can also be found in plastic.

and you will still need oil to produce Hydrogen as an example.

But lets not say oil must finish why not use oil only to make a different fuel type, Ethanol ? surly etanol with some minor conventions on a petrol driven motor is posible.?

[MrDeVil_909]

The main problem with ethanol is that huge tracts of land currently used to produce food will need to be replaced with ethanol crops. So the large scale switch to ethanol would mean widespread starvation.

I don't believe that retrofitting a petrol car to ethanol is a huge issue, most modern cars would probably just need to be reprogrammed. Older cars without electronic ignition would be more complex. An then there are the various petrol/ethanol mixes that could be tuned to each car.

As you say Hex, petrol is popular because it is cheap. And every other propulsion has multiple downsides. Hydrogen is highly unstable, difficult to store and expensive to produce. Electric cars have limited range, are expensive and the electricity needs to come from power-stations, either coal or nuclear, so it is still a dirty energy source.

The Toyota Prius is a supposedly 'environmentally friendly' car yet it is the second most polluting car in the world in the production stages and disposing of its batteries is highly toxic.

[SoulBlade]

THE TAX ON all fuel should be increased by at least 630c/litre to 750c. That will push the Gauteng price of 93 octane fuel and diesel up to at least R13/litre. In exchange for this, Finance Minister Trevor Manuel can do away completely with the current 14% VAT on all other products.

this might be able to work...

Source

Once again, this shouldn't mean any sleepless nights for CEOs in the motor industry.

This article is not available at present. Please try again later.

The article has been removed. Can anybody post the full one if possible?

[Charger14]

Oh hell no they must never do this...

Think now, you run your Fiesta, 40 litres works out to R520 a tank, R650 a tank if you have a golf and put 50 liters in. No these are the cheaper cars you can get. The whole idea is people who need economical transport. Trying to pay for petrol is bad enough at the moment at R7 a litre.

Then another thing,the 14% may be gone, but prices wont change, they'll probably get worse since transport costs of these goods is so much higher now

You may save on other goods, but is it really justified to almost double for your petrol? We dont even have a public transport system to fall back on at all.

[Spicy-McHaggis]

THE TAX ON all fuel should be increased by at least 630c/litre to 750c. That will push the Gauteng price of 93 octane fuel and diesel up to at least R13/litre. In exchange for this, Finance Minister Trevor Manuel can do away completely with the current 14% VAT on all other products.

this might be able to work...

Source

Once again, this shouldn't mean any sleepless nights for CEOs in the motor industry.

This article is not available at present. Please try again later.

The article has been removed. Can anybody post the full one if possible?

THE TAX ON all fuel should be increased by at least 630c/litre to 750c. That will push the Gauteng price of 93 octane fuel and diesel up to at least R13/litre. In exchange for this, Finance Minister Trevor Manuel can do away completely with the current 14% VAT on all other products.

Rather than us having to pay VAT on everything we buy, it will only be a case of petrol, diesel and aircraft fuel costing about 630c/litre more.

Then, rather than the Receiver trying to collect VAT from about 500 000 dealers and other business people (or is it perhaps 1m?), the five fuel distributors would just pay a fat cheque to the Receiver at the end of the month.

Then the whole to-do or drudgery, or whatever you want to call it, around the present amnesty for small businesses that didn't pay VAT or some other tax formerly will suddenly be unnecessary.

No need for green tax

A few thousand smart VAT collectors at SARS will become redundant, but no problem, they can be transferred to help the struggling local authorities to collect the R20bn to R30bn of outstanding accounts.

The department's proposed special tax of up to 33% of the purchase price on 4x4 vehicles will also fall away, because at the new proposed fuel price, they will pay this tax in a year in the form of fuel tax.

My proposal has the further advantage that the current incompetent drivers and owners of the 4x4s who forever seem to get stuck on Gauteng's tarred roads will be immediately hit by the higher prices.

And, best of all, the sums add up. The Treasury currently receives about R135bn from VAT. SA currently consumes about 23bn litres of fuel. The proposed new tax of about R6/litre will give the Treasury new revenue of R138bn. That's enough to drop all VAT.

Only five VAT collection points

And for the consumer, it won't make any difference. Take the taxi owner who works (drives) about 40 000km a year at R7/km. On his gross income of R280 000, he has to pay VAT of R38 000. (I know the calculation is done somewhat differently, but let's stick to this simplified calculation for the moment.)

Instead of VAT, he now has to pay about R6 more per litre of fuel. For the 40 000km, the average taxi probably uses 5 700-6 000 litres of fuel. The additional fuel cost will therefore be something like R34 000 to R42 000, which is the same as he saves from the lifting of the VAT.

The average family that enjoys keeping careful accounts will also find that the saving on VAT is about the same as the increase in the cost of fuel.

It also works much easier. In the process, Trevor Manuel will reduce the number of VAT collection points from thousands to only five, and all the VAT fiddling will disappear overnight.

Back to basics

With a new fuel price of R13/litre, all those terrible drivers who need a 4x4 to drive on tarred roads from Johannesburg to Cape Town will have the incentive to go for driving lessons and return to a normal 1 400cc, three-cylinder diesel that runs 18km on a litre of fuel.

Even Brand Pretorius won't have to be overly worried about the effect that the increase in fuel tax will have on Trevor Manuel's finances and loss of revenue. Manuel knows how to balance his Budget.

The necessary fall in the price of 10-cylinder 4x4s will only be a matter for the owners or the banks that financed them. Once again, this shouldn't mean any sleepless nights for CEOs in the motor industry.

PLEASE NOTE: Trader Vic has an interest in a 4x4 with a low range.

[Road_Kill]

Nevermind...