It can do things that aren't covered by DX9 that are covered in DX10, but as far as I know it is missing many simple DX10 features that are requirements for compliance. Like the ability to do geometry shading. In short if you had to take it out of the XBOX, put it on a PCI-E card and write windows drivers for it, it wouldn't make DX10 requirements and would run games in the DX9 code path.
Whilst ostensibly Xenos has been hailed as a Shader Model 3.0 part, its capabilities don't fall directly inline with it and exceed it in some areas giving this more than a whiff of WGF2.0 (Windows Graphics Foundation 2.0 - the new name for DirectX Next / DirectX 10) about it.
da_ripper wrote:oh yes, anyday, and from the pictures of the PS3 i saw, the graphics are really poor...
It must have been very poorly taken screenshots then. Because I can tell you this: AT THE MOMENT (and I stress AT THE MOMENT) the PS3 puts out better graphics than even the 8800GTX. But that's based only on the rendering capabilities and the quality of the games available against that of what's currently available for PC. It would've been best to do a direct comparison but unfortunately the games on PS3 is not out on PC . PC graphics have always superceded that of a console, but we haven't seen those DX10 games yet (and Crysis is yet to come out) so the ball is currently in the PS3's court. But the graphics are definately not poor. Its blady good actually, you really would have to see it with your own eyes to make up your mind. Posting pics and just telling you isn't convincing enough. Heck not even I was convinced, but that was before I plugged it into my tv.
::PS3 60GB::32" HDTV::Pentium D 2.66GHz::X1600PRO 256MB GPU::2GB DDR2 667 RAM::
I went the other day into the shop and checked the graphics of Formula one and was amazed its sickkkk. Here they cost $999 with the Hdmi cables and all with 60 Gb Hdd.Games go for $80-$100.
i've been a geek for a very long time and i love games, computers and anything that has electronics for guts and is shiny on the outside
i've also got all 3 of the gadgets in question here, a pc, a ps3 and an xbox360
the pc vs console debate is just silly, every year i have to spend 10g's to have the latest hardware in my pc, and that's even when importing from the USA to get much better prices, and after 2 years your pc is nothing more than a noisy, power hungry word-processor, it sux but it's true
my ps2 i got 5 years ago, i paid R3500 for the whole kit, since its launch ps2 games have kept getting better and visually more impressive on the same hardware FOR 8 YEARS! because developers get to know the platform and how to exploit it better, just look at Shadow of the Colossus or Tekken 5 for proof of that statement
then there's the fact that your console never crashes! how cool is that? you don't have to fiddle with drivers or incompatibility issues and update hunting to sort out bugs, it's true plug n play in every sense of the word!
and with these new gen consoles you also have all the functionality of a media centre pc: hdd, wifi, net browser, online shopping for games and demos, watching movies, music, a BT DVD remote control (ps3), usb support, mem card support, blablabla
i'm pretty sure that by the end of the year pc's will have surpassed the ps3 or the xbox360 in the gfx department, just look at the Crysis videos and the 8800GTX specs, but pc gfx surpassed ps2 gfx years ago and did anybody really care? developers just got cleverer in the presentation of games, making games that have more than just eye-candy going for them, games with things like great gameplay!
until i came across this article i didn't know that the xbox360 was superior in gfx to the ps3, i just got the xbox360 for Gears of War, great friggin game!
but as far as i know, correct me on this if i'm wrong, the ps3 has a superior cpu, and in games the cpu handles things such as the 'architecture', basically the wireframe before the gpu applies the textures and everything else, with reference to this i've noticed that in Gears of Wars (which looks incredible!), when you look closely everything is very blocky, there are visibly less poly's in all the models, the dev guys were just very clever at using contrast and vivid textures to create those great looks...
in contrast, Resistance: Fall of Man, is incredibly detailed, it doesn't come close to the gritty, moody feel of Gears of War but all the models all over the game are incredibly smooth, the textures are so detailed you can zoom in on them while on an HD TV and they don't get pixellated, there is also plenty of scenes where the screen is filled with fire, smoke, dust, flying debris, fleeing pigeons, explosions, bullets, giant vehicles and screaming aliens all at the same time, with no drop in frame rate, unless you're in co-op mode and then the framerate will only drop in such extreme situations, also, current games are mostly displayed in 720p but there are already games available that do 1080p
(a friend actually gave me Resistance as a bday present, my bday being on the launch date of the ps3, and that was my incentive for relenting and whipping out the credit card to buy the damn thing a week later)
in defence of the ps3, the playstation franchise has been the overwhelmingly dominant platform in the console market since the PS1 was launched years ago, there are literally thousands of games for the ps1 and ps2, many of them exclusives with huge fan bases eg. Gran Turismo and Final Fantasy
and there is no reason, besides a bit of an uneventful launch, to think that this tradition won't continue with the ps3
then there's the sixaxis motion sensing controller, there are just so many different ways that this feature can be applied (and are being applied) to games to make them more interactive and entertaining
like someone said previously in this thread, the ps3 has the latest goodies, like blu-ray support, which is already in use, Resistance: Fall of Man is on Blu-Ray
plus, there's no subscription fees like there is with xbox live!
in defence of the xbox360
the downside, right now, to the ps3, is the lack of good titles, a lot of filler titles available online to get us through this barren phase (like lemmings and rub a dub, which i bought, damnit) and the shameless porting of ps2 titles to the ps3, like Tekken 5 DR, which i've got, which looks almost identical to Tekken 5 on ps2, which i've got, except for being higher res...
then there's the absence of the 'rumble' from the controls, something that the xbox360 has (along with the controller being heavy enough to kill someone), the reasons for this is probably a combination of controller weight, battery size and the sixaxis motion sensor, but i'm pretty sure that in the near future, with the advances in battery technology, sony will release wireless sixaxis controllers with rumble and descent weight
so, if i had to give my honest opinion on which one to get...
get a gaming pc if you like spending money annually and reading complicated articles and reviews in order to always have the latest stuff to play the latest games with, and don't forget the hours spent fiddling, troubleshooting, installing, rebooting, swapping hardware, downloading patches etc. etc.
if you are one of us ppl who don't have the time available for all the intricacies of a pc and you're opting for a console, then:
get the xbox360 if you're an instant gratification junkie (in a good way), you'll get to play the games that are available and hot right now, you'll have great graphics and great gameplay and pretty close to the latest in console technology
but you'll be kicking yourself in a year when all your patient friends start getting ps3's with all those exclusive titles and a free blu-ray player to boot!
if you can wait, give the ps3 a year and get it then, it'll be cheaper and there'll be more great titles than you can shake a stick at, the developers will have the platform under the belt and the graphics (and gameplay) will blow your mind (have you seen Genji: DOTB?)
basically, the way i justify spending that steep amount on the ps3 (which really isn't that steep when compared to an equivalent pc at all) is that i'm not going to have to spend anything on hardware for at least another 5 years, when we MIGHT see the ps4 in development... and i get to be the only guy for several square kilometres likely to own a ps3, thus i get to satisfy my need for the 'i've got a ps3!' factor for a while!
so that's my 20 cents, feel free to flame me, rant on me and verbally abuse me if you're so inclined, but i reckon i got most of the facts straight on this one, and you'll still be an a$$hole
then:
1) Comparing console vs console is fine. console vs PC is still retarded. They are not even remotely in the same league.
2) On the topic of retarded, the control mechanisms available for consoles are just so: when the application has to expend clock cycles on assisted aiming/steering, something rotten is afoot in console-land...
3) The continued insistence that PC's are unstable, (mine last crashed somewhere around august of last year), is still the saddest attempt at undermining the PCs superiority. you can continue to harp on about stability, but in the same breath, you need to acknowledge that i) You're either an inveterate MAC user or ii) you fiddle far too much with this 'complex' piece of kit.
4) Please tell me the 360 has more than just 1 game, (GoW), as this seems to be the only one available, (base on the fact that it's the only one mentioned when it comes to graphics comparisons), or is this, too, an untruth masking the horde of shoddy titles out there?
5) please elaborate on how, exactly, the console is the epitome of plug-and-play?... last time i tried to get my brother's xbox to recognise my vibrating dolphin screen cleaner, it responded with a BSoD....
BobTheDinosaur wrote:but i reckon i got most of the facts straight on this one, and you'll still be an a$$hole
- the whole reason for my reply, i believe, is that, for a first post, you started out so well... well thought out, (for the most part), semi-informed and logical.... and then you had to ruin it all by acting like some juvenile version of chris rock... are you not as confident in your stance as you would have us believe? hmm
fair warning, swearing, even masked, earns you zero respect anywhere in the real world.... it's not as clever as it first appears, and undermines your character in the eyes of others.
Most people would sooner die than think; in fact, they do so - Bertrand Russel
I don't know what to say... "Can't believe what this world is coming to" maybe? In actual fact though, I'm more surprised at the rate it's getting there.
No wonder every politician and his sidekick are blaming video games on violence in society. Its fools like Sony that are fueling the situation. One day, games will be like contraban, only available on the black market, and through your local Nigerian...
Almost similar to why I prefer console gaming than PC gaming. Eye candy doesn't do it for me.
My friend has a 360 and a PC (8800 + blabla) on a 42" 1080i and it looks great. For the past few weeks I play on there when I go over but it isn't something that drives a lasting feeling home. It just looks great, nothing else much.
Also, is there anything else on the 360? FEAR looked like rubbish and so did NFSC.
A very subjective analysis of xbox 360/PS 3/PC Gaming (Not PC's but PC gaming)
- FPS is best on a PC. Nothing beats the lightning keyboard-mouse combo. Period. The same holds true for RTS.
- Action/Adventure/RPG and pretty much everything else I can think of is better on the console.
- PS3 games best 360 games overall. Currently the only game I might enjoy on the PS3 would be Gundam musou. On the 360? GoW? No.
- In time Final Fantasy/DMC/Resident Evil/MGS/etc will be released on the PS3. Some will be multi platform, but the games that I like to play will mostly appear on the PS3
- Each corporate body is out to make money. Being a suck up doesn't pay.
- PC's cost too much too keep up with the Jones'. Only an elite few will enjoy it.
Too much more cliched BS to post so I'll give it stiff and straight.
PS3 would be my option.
- Once off investment. I had my ps2 for a long time whilst I've upgraded my PC twice and the games still look like horse hay. Not to mention all the technical BS.
- And the winning reason is that eastern games appear mostly on the PS console. And I just love eastern games. Tenchu, Shinobido, Valkyrie Profile, The Tales' Series, etc. These games are the best I've played. 360 and PC games never came close. Caharacters and stories are memorable. Who was that chop that ran around in HL and HL2. Morgan Freeman? No?
Well except maybe a soft spot for an odd RTS or FPS. Wow this post is pretty incongruent. WTH...
The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge.
Wow you PS fans never give up do you? Its good for you, you can go spend like 5k or so on a mere console, nice about sony. I mean PS fans defend it as if they are there life long brothers... Its actually starting to annoy me now. If you like your console then FINE, but don't go around making accusations on who is the better. thanks
Dooms, you're misunderstanding.
I'm where the fun is. If it's 360, I'm there. If it's PC, I'm there. Got it?
And I quote myself:
- Each corporate body is out to make money. Being a suck up doesn't pay.
did i swear?
really?
@Zero
ye, i'm with you on that one
if its got what i want then its cool, but you gotta justify the 8g's for the ps3 kit now don't you?
but after writing that huge post i decided to actually go research the issue and came across quite a few articles pointing out that the xbox360 is superior in not only in gfx but in cpu power as well... news to me
apparently its got to do with the ps3 having 7 'cpu's' that are good at floating point calcs (off the top of my head), in which case its twice as fast as the 360 which has 3 multipurpose cpu's
when doing 'realworld' calcs (according to some people) the xbox is about 4 times as fast as the ps3
i'll post the links as soon as i find them in my history
the xbox is also supposed to be easier to code for, thus devs will end up abandoning the ps3 cos it's real hard to code for, this is obviously all just speculation and only time will tell, for now my xbox can gather dust while i chop up ninjas on my ps3
sorry for all the xbox360 fans who took my article personally, go buy a ps3 and get over it
then:
1) Comparing console vs console is fine. console vs PC is still retarded. They are not even remotely in the same league.
2) On the topic of retarded, the control mechanisms available for consoles are just so: when the application has to expend clock cycles on assisted aiming/steering, something rotten is afoot in console-land...
3) The continued insistence that PC's are unstable, (mine last crashed somewhere around august of last year), is still the saddest attempt at undermining the PCs superiority. you can continue to harp on about stability, but in the same breath, you need to acknowledge that i) You're either an inveterate MAC user or ii) you fiddle far too much with this 'complex' piece of kit.
4) Please tell me the 360 has more than just 1 game, (GoW), as this seems to be the only one available, (base on the fact that it's the only one mentioned when it comes to graphics comparisons), or is this, too, an untruth masking the horde of shoddy titles out there?
5) please elaborate on how, exactly, the console is the epitome of plug-and-play?... last time i tried to get my brother's xbox to recognise my vibrating dolphin screen cleaner, it responded with a BSoD....
BobTheDinosaur wrote:but i reckon i got most of the facts straight on this one, and you'll still be an a$$hole
- the whole reason for my reply, i believe, is that, for a first post, you started out so well... well thought out, (for the most part), semi-informed and logical.... and then you had to ruin it all by acting like some juvenile version of chris rock... are you not as confident in your stance as you would have us believe? hmm
fair warning, swearing, even masked, earns you zero respect anywhere in the real world.... it's not as clever as it first appears, and undermines your character in the eyes of others.
1) i'm sorry if you really like pc's and took my article personally
2) i've been in the pc business for years, i used to sell em and fix em, i started doing that when i was 15 and i enjoyed it a heck of a lot, i still build my own rigs and help friends out every now and then, but i decided that techies are a dime a dozen and i'd make a lot more money doing something that not every teenager can do just as well, i know enough about pc's to know that you can't do your PhD and still have enough time for the idiosynchracies of your average pc running an MS OS just so you can have a little recreational alien shooting fun, i've only recently gotten into macs and they're not all that great either, they crash too, and they don't even have good games!
3) i know my article wasn't very academic, i didn't have any sources, i didn't have much research, my samples are too small, my argument is as thin as toilet paper, bla bla bla, but at least i tried, if i wanted to do a thesis on this topic i wouldn't have posted it here
4) however, simply refuting someone's premises does not necessarily mean that the true conclusion is what you want it to be, so i invite you to bring your own findings to the table with a conclusion that would show me to be wrong
5) the closing line, that was intended for ppl who flame, rant and verbally abuse
they're still assholes
i don't know what a vibrating dolphin screen cleaner is or why it's got dolphin in the name, i don't think i really wanna know, but i'm sure if you plugged it into my ps3, it wouldn't BSOD, it might squeal though
Last edited by BobTheDinosaur on 01 May 2007, 22:17, edited 1 time in total.
Seen Killzone or Lair. Sure as hell looks better than the Gears of War.
But gfx isn't no.1 on my list. So I won't wage war with limb and life on the gfx department.
I just won't be seeing Dynasty Warriors, Nippon Ichi, Dragon Quest, Shadow Hearts, etc on anything besides a PS3.
The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance - it is the illusion of knowledge.
