F1 2005!!!

RVFmal · Post by **RVFmal** » 23 Jun 2005, 15:07

Absolutely correct Anakha. Either way it was going to be virtually impossible to rectify the situation and find a workable solution. Whilst the crowd were upset at not having got to see a proper race, one must understand the stance that Michelin took based on safety. One cannot fault that. However it still does not allow for the Michelin runners to immediately assume that they can call for changes that would compromise the other teams who did not have any tyre problems.

As for Mr Stoddard, if he were a man of conviction he would have stood by the Michelin teams as he initially said he would regardless of the possible fallout. However he chose to race and accepted the points given to him. doesn't say much for the man's integrity. It is easy to stand in his position and say, "I fully agree with the Michelin teams, but........."

VoodooProphetII · Post by **VoodooProphetII** » 23 Jun 2005, 15:19

RV....Thanks for the statement...or lets say loooong read. Very interesting I must say, but I can't really say that I could take everything I here about last Sunday to heart..... But I do believe there is a lot of things that we as fans are not told, and best kept in the dark.....and maybe I'm just really sceptic. I just hope F1 gets back to it's glory days......

elbow · Post by **elbow** » 24 Jun 2005, 01:11

VoodooProphetII wrote:RV....Thanks for the statement...or lets say loooong read. Very interesting I must say, but I can't really say that I could take everything I here about last Sunday to heart..... But I do believe there is a lot of things that we as fans are not told, and best kept in the dark.....and maybe I'm just really sceptic. I just hope F1 gets back to it's glory days......

I agree, lets just hope this doesnt happen again and hope that the rest of the season will be a cracking contest! Go Kimi go!!!!!!!

Post by **Anakha56** » 24 Jun 2005, 09:30

Question's to Max Mosley

It kinda contradict's the Minardi report oh well June 29 is going to be extremely intresting i just hope that no team's get a penalty point deduction as it would nearly ruin Alonso and Kimi's fight for the championship...

Letter's to the Team's

Im getting really depressed reading all this

RVFmal · Post by **RVFmal** » 24 Jun 2005, 11:18

As with any political situation, the masses will never know the real truth as to what happens/happened behind the scenes.

Max has a point in that by calling the Teams to a tribunal, they at least get to tell their side of the story outside of just the media which in some cases twists staements made to their own ends.

The answers given by Mr Mosely were, in my opinion, a good reflection of the reasons for the stnace that the FIA took. As I have have said before, even though what happened on Sunday was a travesty and should never have happened, it is time for the teams to get on with the rest of the season and do what they do best - Race!

btbk_ice · Post by **btbk_ice** » 26 Jun 2005, 20:56

If the michelin tyres cant keep up shouldnt the drivers racing the michelens then slow down? The bridgestones must slow down on wet tracks, and they dont moan and try to change the track to suit their needs.

As far as i can understand, the rule about one set of tyres per race was meant to slow down the whole grand prix, not to allow bitching and moanin when you cant race as fast as you did the previous years.

Frankly the choice of michelin to instruct the teams to abandon the race was a very poor one, they should rather have instructed the teams to drive slower and save the tires.

Quite funny that one of the rules made to obvously disadvantage bridgestone/ferrari turned against michelin.

It is perfectly right to punish michelin for "bringing the sport in disrepute" for their action, if ferrari was punished for forcing barrichello to let shummacher pass last year that only changed the outcome of first and second place, then michelin MUST be fined for their actions that ruined a whole race and the image of formula one in the USA

Post by **Anakha56** » 30 Jun 2005, 07:22

Michi to pay compensation money

A letter between Michi and the FIA

World Motosport commision report

Press Conference Transcript with Max Mosley

It looks like the teams have been found guilty on 2 account's and the penalty's will only be decided in September 14...

Kitt-E-Kat · Post by **Kitt-E-Kat** » 30 Jun 2005, 07:25

The big question at the end of the day has to be whether all the changes to the rules and regulations surrounding F1 are benefitting The FIA, The Championship or The Spectators.

VoodooProphetII · Post by **VoodooProphetII** » 30 Jun 2005, 07:45

Kitt-E...that's the best question I heard from comming outa all of this.... I can't say anymore, and I can't answer this, because I feel there's a lot more to it then we think, which is maybe why some teams want to break away as was said before. If they will, well I doubt it will happen, and I hope not.....

VoodooProphetII · Post by **VoodooProphetII** » 30 Jun 2005, 07:45

Oh and Anakha...thanx for the info....

Post by **Anakha56** » 30 Jun 2005, 07:51

not a problem i have been eagrly waiting for this info ever since i heard the teams were going b4 the World Council and i must say if the teams can force Michi to pay out the spectator's with compensation money and free seat's for the next grand prix we could possible see no fine's being imposed on the team's, but that is unlikely. here is hoping though...

at least mm said that taking points off of the championship would not be a good idea...

dammod · Post by **dammod** » 30 Jun 2005, 09:10

Taking point off would be a great idea!!!

(lol, j/k)

VoodooProphetII · Post by **VoodooProphetII** » 30 Jun 2005, 09:51

Damian...I can just imagine you saying something like that.......LOL

Post by **Kronos** » 30 Jun 2005, 10:17

btbk_ice wrote:If the michelin tyres cant keep up shouldnt the drivers racing the michelens then slow down? The bridgestones must slow down on wet tracks, and they dont moan and try to change the track to suit their needs.

As far as i can understand, the rule about one set of tyres per race was meant to slow down the whole grand prix, not to allow bitching and moanin when you cant race as fast as you did the previous years.

Frankly the choice of michelin to instruct the teams to abandon the race was a very poor one, they should rather have instructed the teams to drive slower and save the tires.

Quite funny that one of the rules made to obvously disadvantage bridgestone/ferrari turned against michelin.

It is perfectly right to punish michelin for "bringing the sport in disrepute" for their action, if ferrari was punished for forcing barrichello to let shummacher pass last year that only changed the outcome of first and second place, then michelin MUST be fined for their actions that ruined a whole race and the image of formula one in the USA

Have you been under a rock for the last 2 weeks?

The FIA DID give the Michi runners the choice of racing, but slowing down on turn 13.

The whole point why the teams didn't want to drive slower is because then it wouldn't be a RACE in the full sense of the word. Look at my post earlier in this thread about this issue. The Spectators would still be unhappy if the "Race" is still just run between 6 cars because the other cars have to slow down.

The Problem is that the FIA are not going to Punish Michellin because they are a supplier and not a competitor. They are instead trying to punish the teams for not having suitable tires??? WTF Read the articles on the F1 website. That's why 6 of the 7 teams are going to appeal the decision by the FIA, because they have been found guilty of not having suitable tires, yet they used an FIA approved supplier (Michellin).

As for the other charge of them not acting with the rules and at least letting the marshals know that they are gonna pull out. Well, we'd have to say guilty as charged.

My POV on this though is that the punishment should be towards Michellin and the Team management. Either Fine Michi and the Team management, or take points off of the constructors champs, but don't take points away from the drivers. They only do what the manager tells them. they didn't make a personal choice not to race. Most of them were more than prepared to race anyway.

Kitt-E-Kat · Post by **Kitt-E-Kat** » 30 Jun 2005, 12:14

I have been involved in Motor Racing in SA for years - and I can cleary say without a shadow of a doubt that there is always a story behind a story.

I have reached the point where I wouldn't expect anything less than sensualism in motorsport.

RVFmal · Post by **RVFmal** » 30 Jun 2005, 12:31

I think that this has gone on long enough as there is never going to be an end to this saga. Michelin brought the wrong tyres to the race and have said as much. The teams never raced based on advice given to them by Michelin for safety reasons. Simple.

To find the teams guilty is in itself silly as the FIA are negating the fact that safety is paramount in this sport, something that they themselves have spewed forth thousands of times.

It is time for damage control, not more fighting. The way this is going it would not surprise me should all the teams walk away (that however will never happen due to the vast sums of money involved).

Michelin has agreed to pay back the price of the tickets and the teams and drivers are ready to race. Should that not be the most importatnt thing at this point in time?

Being an avid supporter of motorsport for many a year, I find what is happening now atrocious and unbecoming of a professional sport. The FIA should censure Michelin not the teams and continue the way forward with racing, not frigging politics.

Enough of the fighting, lets race!

Kitt-E-Kat · Post by **Kitt-E-Kat** » 30 Jun 2005, 12:44

Hear! Hear!

Where are the days when you won a championship based on skill and determination.

RVFmal · Post by **RVFmal** » 30 Jun 2005, 12:53

Kitt-E-Kat wrote:Hear! Hear!

Where are the days when you won a championship based on skill and determination.

Been watching MotoGP lately? *grin*

Kitt-E-Kat · Post by **Kitt-E-Kat** » 30 Jun 2005, 12:57

At this point I get more enjoyment from watching ads on TV then the GP

Kitt-E-Kat · Post by **Kitt-E-Kat** » 30 Jun 2005, 12:58

I officiated at the last two MotoGP's held in SA. What an experience!

RVFmal · Post by **RVFmal** » 30 Jun 2005, 15:33

Kitt-E-Kat wrote:I officiated at the last two MotoGP's held in SA. What an experience!

Get to pick up any pieces?

Daz · Post by **Daz** » 30 Jun 2005, 16:06

RVFmal wrote:I think that this has gone on long enough as there is never going to be an end to this saga. Michelin brought the wrong tyres to the race and have said as much. The teams never raced based on advice given to them by Michelin for safety reasons. Simple.

To find the teams guilty is in itself silly as the FIA are negating the fact that safety is paramount in this sport, something that they themselves have spewed forth thousands of times.

It is time for damage control, not more fighting. The way this is going it would not surprise me should all the teams walk away (that however will never happen due to the vast sums of money involved).

Michelin has agreed to pay back the price of the tickets and the teams and drivers are ready to race. Should that not be the most importatnt thing at this point in time?

Being an avid supporter of motorsport for many a year, I find what is happening now atrocious and unbecoming of a professional sport. The FIA should censure Michelin not the teams and continue the way forward with racing, not frigging politics.

Enough of the fighting, lets race!

I agree 100 percent !

Post by **Kronos** » 04 Jul 2005, 09:48

I think this tells the whole story!

http://www.formula1.com/race/result/741/8.html

Pardon me if I sound like a fan boy, but I think that Kimi Raikkonen is da bomb!!

If you look at that page in particular. Kimi Qualified in 3rd with almost enough fuel for 30 laps.

Then he had to move back 10 grid places because of the engine change. starting in 13th place, and STILL beat MS who started in 3rd.

Now I know the Ferrari and MS fans might say, yeah, but MS got stuck behind Trulli. True. But remember that Trulli held up everyone else too. Kimi was already 30 seconds behind Alonso at his (Alonso) first pit. And he only finished 11.8 seconds behind him, While MS was almost lapped. Plus, Kimi scored the fastest lap of the race when the track was clear after Trulli got out of the way.

I'm Glad that Alonso is doing so well this year, even though I'm a Kimi fan, and I'm glad that MS is sort of challenging again (well, more than anyone else anyway). This will just mean that he will have a front row seat to see his World Champion Status being taken away from him.

I've been saying it for the last 2 years: Put kimi in a reliable car, and his gonna give the other drivers a Whipping!

Go Kimi!!!

Post by **Anakha56** » 04 Jul 2005, 09:58

hehe I am also glad to see Kimi do that fast run, the question must be asked where was Ferrari's speed? watch the race Kimi get's second and he flies once MS is past Montoya he cant catch the Fin, and he didnt really post any fast times to be impressed with. I am glad to see Alonso result would have loved to see him and Kimi fight it out. All in all a great race...

Kitt-E-Kat · Post by **Kitt-E-Kat** » 04 Jul 2005, 14:00

RVFmal wrote:Kitt-E-Kat wrote:
I officiated at the last two MotoGP's held in SA. What an experience!

Get to pick up any pieces?

Once or twice - Was more worried about having a heart attack from all the excitement myself.