A thread not for the easily offended

[i_r_baboon]

Here swallow this for now:

http://mysticsaint.blogspot.com/2007/01 ... sm-to.html

I have many other Saviour Son's of God's for you

[hamin_aus]

Google Eris Jamin oops

Thats not a planet. Also I don't see any comments about it's orbit coming anywhere remotely close to Earths at any time in the futire.

The discovery of Eris, the largest known dwarf planet



A view of the solar system from the north down. The four circles show the orbits of Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, and Neptune. The yellow dot in the center is the sun. The earth, if it were shown, would be inside the yellow dot representing the sun. The orbits of the two outermost planets, along with their current positions, are also shown. If you are worried because the sun appears to not be the focus of the orbital ellipse you are very observant! But it is just a projection effect.

Here swallow this for now:

http://mysticsaint.blogspot.com/2007/01 ... sm-to.html

You using some idiots blog as proof of your beliefs

[Stuart]

And you're looking for what? A full colour, high resolution photograph? The mere fact that hostile witnesses even MENTIONED "Christ" is evidence that Jesus existed.

well if a guy was walking around healing people, waking on water and feeding the hordes with 3 loaves of bread and 5 fish, there should be a WHOLE lot more historical record, no matter how hostile the writer...

however there is NONE! ZIP, ZILCHO, NADA!

explain if you will, that little anomaly...

Well, you can only hold that view if you assume from the outset that the biblical writings are untrue. Hostile witnesses in the early centuries would have given as much credit to the stories as you do. I don't see you writing volumes making mention of Jesus and his reported miracles. Why would you expect a hostile witness in the early centuries to do so?

[GreyWolf]

I don't see you writing volumes making mention of Jesus and his reported miracles. Why would you expect a hostile witness in the early centuries to do so?

Well if you can point me in the direction of Jesus current earthly location I would be happy to go over and record his feats.

Furthermore you are assuming that all historians of the time were hostile.

Still have not explained the absence of historical record.

[StarPhoenix]

Greywolf:Thank you for the link.

[Hex_Rated]

The average income is lets say R5 000 lol anyway take 2000 of that and times it by atleast 20 million which is less than half of our population. You get R40 000 000 000 a month if i'm not mistaken. I was being very generous with the numbers. Now how good is our police force? bad, worst crime rate. How is our education? Average. How are our roads? Average, traffic. How is our Rand doing? Bad.

We have Gold, Diamonds, Platinum yet our economy is bad. Debt, Debt and more Debt. Banks.
Now would you like to watch the documentary as said earlier and then debate further with me?

1) you dont pay tax under R5000
2) you assume avg 40% tax on R5000! Lol! Very few people pay 40% tax, you need to earn around R50k-R60k / month to pay that.

Sorry man, you dont know what your talking about. Learn the system before you make your crazy paranoid assumptions.

[Stuart]

Furthermore you are assuming that all historians of the time were hostile.

No, I'm not. I'm just saying that the mention by hostile witnesses is a powerful testimony.

Still have not explained the absence of historical record.

That's because such an absence is imagined. I can name four historians off the bat: Matthew, Mark, Luke and John.

And, incidentally, before you write off these guys, particularly Luke, who wrote (in words) more of the New Testament than any other contributor, consider the testimony of Sir William Ramsay:

One of the greatest archaeologists of all time was Sir William Ramsay. He studied under the famous German historical schools in the mid-nineteenth century, which taught that the New Testament was a religious treatise written in the mid-200s AD, and not an historical document recorded in the first century. Ramsay was so convinced of this teaching that he entered the field of archaeology and went to Asia Minor to specifically find the physical evidence to refute Luke's biblical record. After years of field study, Ramsay completely reversed his entire view of the Bible and first century history. He wrote:

Luke is a historian of the first rank; not merely are his statements of fact trustworthy, he is possessed of the true historic sense...in short, this author should be placed along with the greatest of historians.[1]

[1] Sir William M. Ramsay, The Bearing of Recent Discovery on the Trustworthiness of the New Testament, Hodder & Stoughton, 1915

Other (Christian) historical sources:

The Apostles received the Gospel for us from the Lord Jesus Christ; Jesus Christ was sent forth from God. So then Christ is from God, and the Apostles are from Christ. Both therefore came of the will of God in the appointed order. Having therefore received a charge, and having been fully assured through the resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ and confirmed in the word of God with full assurance of the Holy Ghost, they went forth with the glad tidings that the kingdom of God should come. So preaching everywhere in country and town, they appointed their firstfruits, when they had proved them by the Spirit, to be bishops and deacons unto them that should believe.

Jesus Christ who was of the race of David, who was the Son of Mary, who was truly born and ate and drank, was truly persecuted under Pontius Pilate, was truly crucified and died in the sight of those in heaven and on earth and those under the earth; who moreover was truly raised from the dead, His Father having raised Him, who in the like fashion will so raise us also who believe on Him.

He is truly of the race of David according to the flesh, but Son of God by the Divine will and power, truly born of a virgin and baptised by John that all righteousness might be fulfilled by Him, truly nailed up in the flesh for our sakes under Pontius Pilate and Herod the tetrarch (of which fruit are we--that is, of his most blessed passion); that He might set up an ensign unto all ages through His resurrection.

For I know and believe that He was in the flesh even after the resurrection; and when He came to Peter and his company, He said to them, 'Lay hold and handle me, and see that I am not a demon without body.' And straightway they touched him, and they believed, being joined unto His flesh and His blood. Wherefore also they despised death, nay they were found superior to death. And after His resurrection He ate with them and drank with them.

Be ye fully persuaded concerning the birth and the passion and the resurrection, which took place in the time of the governorship of Pontius Pilate; for these things were truly and certainly done by Jesus Christ our hope.

The deeds of our Saviour were always before you, for they were true miracles; those that were healed, those that were raised from the dead, who were seen, not only when healed and when raised, but were always present. They remained living a long time, not only whilst our Lord was on earth, but likewise when He had left the earth. So that some of them have also lived to our own times.

He must needs be manifested in the flesh. ... He preached teaching Israel and performing so many wonders and miracles, and He loved them exceedingly. ... He chose His own apostles who were to proclaim His Gospel. ... But He Himself desired so to suffer; for it was necessary for Him to suffer on a tree.

After referring to Jesus's birth of a virgin in the town of Bethlehem, and that His physical line of descent came through the tribe of Judah and the family of Jesse, Justin wrote, "Now there is a village in the land of the Jews, thirty-five stadia from Jerusalem, in which Jesus Christ was born, as you can ascertain also from the registers of the taxing made under Cyrenius, your first procurator in Judea.

Accordingly, after He was crucified, even all His acquaintances forsook Him, having denied Him; and afterwards, when He had risen from the dead and appeared to them, and had taught them to read the prophecies in which all these things were foretold as coming to pass, and when they had seen Him ascending into heaven, and had believed, and had received power sent thence by Him upon them, and went to every race of men, they taught these things, and were called apostles.

For at the time of His birth, Magi who came from Arabia worshipped Him, coming first to Herod, who then was sovereign in your land.

For when they crucified Him, driving in the nails, they pierced His hands and feet; and those who crucified Him parted His garments among themselves, each casting lots for what he chose to have, and receiving according to the decision of the lot.

Christ said amongst you that He would give the sign of Jonah, exhorting you to repent of your wicked deeds at least after He rose again from the dead ... yet you not only have not repented, after you learned that He rose from the dead, but, as I said before, you have sent chosen and ordained men throughout all the world to proclaim that 'a godless and lawless heresy had sprung from one Jesus, a Galilean deceiver, whom we crucified, but His disciples stole Him by night from the tomb, where He was laid when unfastened from the cross, and now deceive men by asserting that He has risen from the dead and ascended to heaven.'

For indeed the Lord remained upon the tree almost until evening, and they buried Him at eventide; then on the third day He rose again.

[Y0da]

What a bunch of drivel. I wish people would stop calling Satan Lucifer. Repeat after me...Satan is NOT Lucifer. The name Lucifer was only ever used once in the entire Bible and that was in reference to the falling of the king of Babilon. There are really some guillable people in this world.

Lol, that was random! Rant much? Not that I disagree; I just found this post quite funny.

As a matter of interest, the name "Lucifer" is used, as you say, only once in the Bible, and only in the KJV/NKJV (in terms of mainstream Bible translations). All other translations have translation "son of the morning" or something to that effect, and even the NKJV has a footnote with an alternate translation.

I agree!

Unless you are Hansie Cronje.

In which case every bad decision you ever made was the result of the devil meddling in your worldly affairs.

According to his biography/autobiography (whichever it was, I forget), Hansie never actually said, "The devil made me do it." He said something to the effect of, "The devil tempted me," which our grossly integrity-void media turned into the more famous outburst. Knowing the media, that's a story I can quite easily believe.

Sorry to resurrect old posts; I haven't been around this thread for a few days.

Uhm...if you read the link I was quoting, you would have noticed that it was anything but random.

[hamin_aus]

Read a link you posted?
Why that would be almost as foolish as reading a link I posted!

[Stuart]

Uhm...if you read the link I was quoting, you would have noticed that it was anything but random.

No, I did read the link, and saw where you were coming from; it just seemed random in context to the other comments.

[hamin_aus]

Language warning

[rustypup]

Oprah doing what i always believed she would....

i love the dramatic presentation...

[hamin_aus]

2 million Christians converting to the hippie-dippie teachings of Oprah. Meh. It could be worse - they could have become Scientologists...

[D3PART3D]

According to Urban, Scientologists aren't as looney as they're made out to be.

Oprah FTL.

[Kronos]

Yes they are.

But more to the point, why does any one care, or why does it bother anyone what oprah believes?

[D3PART3D]

She's got incredible influence. You live in the same world as her... followers

[hamin_aus]

Oprah FTL.

I did not mean to give the impression that I disagree with you on that.

But sorry to anyone sympathetic to the "religion" of Scientology but...
It's all just made-up stuff. Not that I am saying all the other religions are not based on made-up stuff - it's just that Scientology was made up by L Ron Hubbard.

This is what Scientologists believe

[D3PART3D]

Thanks jamin, going through it now.

[Kronos]

She's got incredible influence. You live in the same world as her... followers

Just because someone has influence, doesn't mean you HAVE to follow her.
You can still make up your own mind.
If what she has to say makes sense to you, then good for you, if it doesn't, move on.

Christianity has a larger following, and their teachings make far less sense.
And people don't follow it because of any preachers' amount of influence.

Pastafarianism is the only way anyway

[Tribble]

@ Kronos. Need to google that religion

[D3PART3D]

Christianity has a larger following, and their teachings make far less sense.

You see the problem with this statement is that you assume you're more intelligent than I am. I can be fooled and you can't be?

[Tribble]

*edit*

I would really love to know what was there - and I bet you are going to say that you double posted. Typical

[Kronos]

Christianity has a larger following, and their teachings make far less sense.

You see the problem with this statement is that you assume you're more intelligent than I am. I can be fooled and you can't be?

No it doesn't.
Firstly, that statement wasn't directed at you. You being christian.
I never even had that thought in my mind when I posted that.

Do you not realize that it could also mean that Those teachings don't make sense to me, because I don't understand them. (That's not the case, but it is an option )

The point is this: As non-sensical as I find religion to be, it doesn't mean that I am claiming "ultimate intelligence above weak minded theists".

Religion is about belief, not about sense, or proof, wouldn't you agree?
You don't need to be a genius to be an atheist, nor do you need to be unintelligent to be religious.
My own girlfriend is christian, and she is one of the most intelligent people I know.

I just don't have that Belief gene activated. Therefore, everything has to make sense, and be open to scientific scrutiny, for it to gain any of my support.

[doo_much]

Pastafarianism

I'm stil rofl'ing!

[Tribble]

Tell me - does she not do a lot of good? Is that not what we want from celebrities that have lots of money?