Sniper kills Qaeda - from 1½ miles away

[capanno]

I think they mean that the targets wouldn't have heard the shots being fired. Bullets are silent but the explosion that sends them flying is not.

I think that if you do the maths the bullet is flying faster than the sound waves and therefore the targets are dead before the sound waves even reach their position,

[doo_much]

Sub sonic bullets are preferred as far as I know. I just doubt that they are used in these long range shots. I know someone who is high ranking in the military, he led many attacks in Angola back in the day, etc. He says the best sniper rifle is a sub sonic .22.

Subsonic .22 will drift over long ranges. 100m yes. 1km no.

The weapon is designed to be effective up to 1,500 metres. To compensate for the spin and drift of the .338 bullets as they flew 1.54 miles - the length of 25 football pitches - Craig had to aim 6ft high and 20ins to the left. Despite the bullets travelling at almost three times the speed of sound, the married dad of one was so far away it took them 2.64 seconds to reach their targets.

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[lancelot]

Now that was something else, two shots, two kills, whether done with a catapult or a Howitzer, wow, what an achievement and two terrs on top of it. I will chisel this mans name on my plastic floor. Pinko, Pinko Pinko

[rustypup]

the married dad of one

i don't know about you, but reporting like this makes me want to shoot people...

[Monty]

Also a sniper would generally not shoot with a supersonic projectile as it lowers the accuracy of the projectile when it breaks through the sound barrier

Uh... Where'd you get that gem of information? For that shot a supersonic round was used (the .338 sound used has a muzzle velocity of about 900m/s).

Errrrr... Classified... I know a couple of ex military snipers

Most of the rifles i know of that are used by snipers all chamber supersonic rounds...

BOOM! Headshot...

Awesome!

Actually no.

According to the article one was hit in the stomach and the other in the side?

Hmm second piece of inside sniper info. A sniper hates shooting for a head shot. The chances of the bullet hitting the head backwards is too great. This causes only a craze on the surface. Although it may cause damage from the compressed air waves, which also hits the target, it still gives the target a higher survivability rating. Go for the chest they say.

At distance, the chest is a larger target.
Swat and police snipers are trained for shorter range, higher accuracy shots (such as head shots) as they often need to make sure the target is dead before they hit the ground, while military snipers are generally trained for longer distance kill shots (they just need to hit their target somewhere vital).

I think they mean that the targets wouldn't have heard the shots being fired. Bullets are silent but the explosion that sends them flying is not.

I think that if you do the maths the bullet is flying faster than the sound waves and therefore the targets are dead before the sound waves even reach their position,

Even if they hadn't been hit, they wouldn't have heard the report as the sound would have disapated (sp)


.22s are good as they have very good penetrating power

[RuadRauFlessa]

Personally I would prefer a .223 for sniping. You have a slightly larger load behind the same grain. Oh and subsonic should be fine for up to 400m-500m I won't try to go much further than that and especially not with a small caliber such as a .22 or a .223.

[Monty]

i'd take a 7.62 round over a 5.56 (.223) round

[doo_much]

i'd take a 7.62 round over a 5.56 (.223) round

Agreed.
I once had the priviledge of taking a few pot shots over 1000m with a R1 sniper conversion.

Only hit 2/10 'valplate'

[RuadRauFlessa]

i'd take a 7.62 round over a 5.56 (.223) round

Agreed.
I once had the priviledge of taking a few pot shots over 1000m with a R1 sniper conversion.

Only hit 2/10 'valplate'

hehe you need some practice. 'valplate' are big. Try matchboxes at 250m. It is what we used to practice with at the range.


Oh and when I say we I mean me and my dad. Used to do combat shooting and we had a couple of rifle sessions each month. Quite fun actually.

[ryanrich]

BOOM! Headshot...

Awesome!

Actually no.

According to the article one was hit in the stomach and the other in the side?

Hmm second piece of inside sniper info. A sniper hates shooting for a head shot. The chances of the bullet hitting the head backwards is too great. This causes only a craze on the surface. Although it may cause damage from the compressed air waves, which also hits the target, it still gives the target a higher survivability rating. Go for the chest they say.

Flip, you guys hey.

I wasn't being literal in case you were wondering...

[doo_much]

hehe you need some practice. 'valplate' are big. Try matchboxes at 250m. It is what we used to practice with at the range.

Needed. A lot of it.
This was 20 odd years ago when I was in the Army. Got my 'Goue Balkie' for combat shooting with the R4.

What rifles did you use on the range?

[Hman]

The AS50 is the current daddy of sniper rifles.

[Prime]

Nope.... At 1.5mil you would have approximately 5.5-4.8sec flight time on a projectile depending on the muzzle velocity, initial angle, size and weight of the projectile. If you take the rotation of the earth into account it would also depend on the direction the projectile is traveling in (East or West). When the projectile is traveling in an easterly direction the flight time would be reduced due to the target actually moving closer the whole time and the opposite for west. Also a sniper would generally not shoot with a supersonic projectile as it lowers the accuracy of the projectile when it breaks through the sound barrier

Yes but hang on, what reference frame are you working in? I would think that the velocity of the earth would have a negligible effect on the bullet given the time frame?

*goes hunting for the rotational velocity of the earth*

Edit: can't work it out; need the surface velocity of the earth in the region of afghanistan which will be different to the velocity of the earth at the equator because the radius around the axis of rotation will be smaller. NM

[RuadRauFlessa]

*goes hunting for the rotational velocity of the earth*

29.78 km/s[3]
107,200 km/h

I would say that could cause a sizable difference especially over a longer distance

[Prime]

*goes hunting for the rotational velocity of the earth*

29.78 km/s[3]
107,200 km/h

I would say that could cause a sizable difference especially over a longer distance

See my edit in my previous post.

I was going to sit and work it out but need a parameter that I don't have and I don't feel like calculating anything else it so I'll take your word for it. (also my brain is fuzzled today)

Where I got with my calculations was:

rotational velocity (not omega) is roughly 30000m/s at the equator.

Radius of earth at equator 6378,1KM

angular velocity = v/r = 0.0047 radians/second

Angular velocity is constant. not tangential velocity. but i couldn't workout the tangential velocity.

[RuadRauFlessa]

Prime no need to feel alone mate. I'm not even going to attempt the maths.

[KillerByte]

.22s are good as they have very good penetrating power

Wait, WHAT!?

There are weapons with far greater penetration than the .22

Take a .300WSM for example (a weapon I have fired and used on numerous occasions)

I have seen the rounds from that weapon slice through a Kudu's neck at 150M (the head was completely removed), on a seperate hunting trip my Uncle was able to take down a Blouwildebeest at 400m. If my maths is correct (and if it isn't then rusty will no doubt point it out) that bullet leaves the muzzle at 3 times the speed of sound, a .22 cannot match the power of that weapon.

I do not claim to be an expert in weapons and if I am wrong then I urge some one with more knowledge to correct me.



sourcefor the below article

The .300 WSM (Winchester Short Magnum) has slightly less powder capacity than the standard length .300 Winchester Magnum. With bullets in the 150-180 grain weight range, however, its performance is essentially identical to that of the established .300 Win. Mag.

Winchester figures for the .300 WSM with a 24" test barrel claim a muzzle velocity of 3300 fps and ME of 3628 ft. lbs. for the 150 grain bullet. The 200 yard figures are 2834 fps and 2676 ft. lbs.

Winchester claims a MV of 2970 fps with 3526 ft. lbs. of muzzle energy for the 180 grain bullet. The 200 yard figures are 2524 fps and 2547 ft. lbs. Those figures are nearly identical to the velocity of the .300 Winchester Magnum taken in the same length barrel, and also to the figures for the .300 Rem. SAUM in a 24" test barrel.

Here are some .300 WSM statistics of interest to reloaders: bullet diameter .308", maximum COL 2.86", maximum case length 2.10".

Like all .30 caliber cartridges, there is a huge array of bullets available to the .300 WSM reloader, ranging from 100-250 grains. However, the very light 100-125 grain bullets make little sense in any .300 Magnum cartridge, and the short .300 WSM case does not handle bullets heavier than 180 grain very efficiently. So bullets from 150-180 grains are usually the best choice in the .300 WSM.

The medium to slow burning rifle powders work best in the .300 WSM. Examples include H380, H414, H4831, IMR 4064, IMR 4350, IMR 4831, VIHT N-550, and W760.

The fifth edition of the Nosler Reloading Guide shows that 56.5 grains of IMR 4064 behind their 150-155 grain bullets produced a MV of 3063 fps. A maximum load of 60.5 grains of the same powder produced a MV of 3242 fps. IMR 4064 proved to be the most accurate powder with bullets of this weight in the Nosler tests.

Nosler figures show that 60.0 grains of H380 powder behind their 165-168 grain bullets gave a MV of 2940 fps, and a maximum charge of 64.0 grains of H380 gave a MV of 3087 fps. H380 was the most accurate powder with these bullet weights.

Nosler figures for the .300 WSM show that 61.0 grains of IMR 4350 powder will drive their 180 grain bullets to a MV of 2861 fps, and 65.0 grains of the same powder will give a MV of 3024 fps. Nosler used Winchester brass and primers for these loads. All of these Nosler loads used Winchester brass and WLRM primers. Note that these Nosler figures were developed in a 26" test barrel.

[RuadRauFlessa]

KB you are correct... However there are very few weapons with the accuracy of a .22 or .222 Even the .223's accuracy is sub standard against the .222

doo_much: Used my dad's .303 very nice rifle and if you manage to get the one with the extended barrel you have something to be proud of. The combat shooting itself I did with a Colt .45 with counterweights and a .28g trigger weight. Also had a modification made since the trigger weight is so light where you have to actually suppress a pressure plate at the back of the grip in order to allow the firing pin to go off. Also had the loader polished. Was as such that I was actually able to load empty casings without bending them. The Col .45 also has another issue which is quite annoying if you tend to reload your own ammo, When the spent casing is ejected it hits the side of the opening. I also had this opening enlarged so as to not damage the casings.

[KillerByte]

Yeah accuracy with a .22 is brilliant, mainly because you have no reason to fear the recoil, there isn't any. LOL

The .300WSM than my Uncle has kicks like a mule and after an afternoon with that weapon my shoulder is sore.

[rustypup]

it's not about the size of the round... it's about the speed and concomitant mass it translates to... this is what makes rail-guns, (when they finally produce reliable kit), so devastating... a .22 offers reduced surface drag per payload over larger, (heavier), bores, hence its popularity for precision distance kills... it would be pants at most other applications...

@doo_much: i remember shooting for balkies! "sneller beheer!"...had the pleasure of a fully stocked container + private range to play silly buggers as often as we wanted... all on the taxpayer's dime... ...

[RuadRauFlessa]

AFAIK the .300WSM kicks less than a .303

[DeathStrike]

you guys are going into details that i don't know anything about. lol. i have no idea what a .303 is for example. i take it its a gun of sorts.

i am limited to ak 47s and colt. 45mm.

Where do you guys learn all this stuff about guns.. wait let me think.

you guys google about it right?

[Monty]

you guys are going into details that i don't know anything about. lol. i have no idea what a .303 is for example. i take it its a gun of sorts.

i am limited to ak 47s and colt. 45mm.

Where do you guys learn all this stuff about guns.. wait let me think.

you guys google about it right?

the .(number) is the calibre of the bullet (how wide it is).


You learn via Google, books, other people with interest in guns.

[Mykhal]

At the moment my own gun is my preferred calibre : .25-20! Very fast, very accurate and no recoil to mention!

[Prime]

you guys are going into details that i don't know anything about. lol. i have no idea what a .303 is for example. i take it its a gun of sorts.

i am limited to ak 47s and colt. 45mm.

Where do you guys learn all this stuff about guns.. wait let me think.

you guys google about it right?

the .(number) is the calibre of the bullet (how wide it is).


You learn via Google, books, other people with interest in guns.

Game manuals, eg, one of the d20 supplements has pictures and specifications of probably close on a thousand firearms