Israel Hezbolla conflict

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capanno
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Israel Hezbolla conflict

Post by capanno »

So I thought we might need a thread, for those who want to talk about it.

Check this out:
canada.com wrote: Hezbollah was using UN post as 'shield'

Joel Kom, with files from Steven Edwards, CanWest News Service, The Ottawa Citizen
Published: Thursday, July 27, 2006

The words of a Canadian United Nations observer written just days before he was killed in an Israeli bombing of a UN post in Lebanon are evidence Hezbollah was using the post as a "shield" to fire rockets into Israel, says a former UN commander in Bosnia.

Those words, written in an e-mail dated just nine days ago, offer a possible explanation as to why the post -- which according to UN officials was clearly marked and known to Israeli forces -- was hit by Israel on Tuesday night, said retired Maj.-Gen. Lewis MacKenzie yesterday.

The strike hit the UN observation post in the southern Lebanese village of El Khiam, killing Canadian Maj. Paeta Hess-von Kruedener and three others serving as unarmed UN military observers in the area.

Just last week, Maj. Hess-von Kruedener wrote an e-mail about his experiences after nine months in the area, words Maj.-Gen. MacKenzie said are an obvious allusion to Hezbollah tactics.

"What I can tell you is this," he wrote in an e-mail to CTV dated July 18. "We have on a daily basis had numerous occasions where our position has come under direct or indirect fire from both (Israeli) artillery and aerial bombing.

"The closest artillery has landed within 2 meters (sic) of our position and the closest 1000 lb aerial bomb has landed 100 meters (sic) from our patrol base. This has not been deliberate targeting, but rather due to tactical necessity."

Those words, particularly the last sentence, are not-so-veiled language indicating Israeli strikes were aimed at Hezbollah targets near the post, said Maj.-Gen. MacKenzie.

"What that means is, in plain English, 'We've got Hezbollah fighters running around in our positions, taking our positions here and then using us for shields and then engaging the (Israeli Defence Forces)," he said.

That would mean Hezbollah was purposely setting up near the UN post, he added. It's a tactic Maj.-Gen. MacKenzie, who was the first UN commander in Sarajevo during the Bosnia civil war, said he's seen in past international missions: Aside from UN posts, fighters would set up near hospitals, mosques and orphanages.

A Canadian Forces infantry officer with the Edmonton-based Princess Patricia's Canadian Light Infantry and the only Canadian serving as a UN military observer in Lebanon, Maj. Hess-von Kruedener was no stranger to fighting nearby.

The UN post, he wrote in the e-mail, afforded a view of the "Hezbollah static positions in and around our patrol Base."

"It appears that the lion's share of fighting between the IDF and Hezbollah has taken place in our area," he wrote, noting later it was too dangerous to venture out on patrols.

The e-mail appears to contradict the UN's claim there had been no Hezbollah activity in the vicinity of the strike.

The question of Hezbollah's infiltration of the area is significant because UN Secretary General Kofi Annan, speaking Tuesday just hours after the bombing, accused the Israelis of the "apparently deliberate targeting" of the base near Khiam in southern Lebanon.

A senior UN official, asked about the information contained in Maj. Hess-von Kruedener's e-mail concerning Hezbollah presence in the vicinity of the Khiam base, denied the world body had been caught in a contradiction.
Another interesthing article:
honestreporting wrote:MYTHS AND FACTS SURROUNDING THE CRISIS

Myth - "Israel's response is disproportionate."

Fact - The definition of a "disproportionate" response is a subjective one. The question that could be asked of any other country in the world is simply: "What would you do in the same situation?" When protecting its citizens, exercising the right to self-defense and responding to missile attacks over a recognized border, most countries would respond in a similar manner. After all, how many Israelis need to die before the world believes that Israeli responses are proportionate?

Any civilian casualties in a conflict are, of course, tragic and regrettable. Civilians on both sides are suffering. However, Israeli air strikes on Lebanon are not intended to kill civilians, unlike the hundreds of Hezbollah missiles that are targeted specifically at Israeli civilians who have been forced into bomb shelters for their own safety. Israel has even dropped leaflets on Beirut suburbs calling on civilians to stay away from Hezbollah strongholds to avoid being caught up in the fighting.

Israel has also been criticized for targeting Lebanese infrastructure such as the Beirut airport. However, it is also interesting to note what has not been targeted. For example, while the airport runway was bombed, other vital installations such as the control tower were left untouched and Lebanese civilian airliners were allowed to fly to safety. Transport hubs and bridges have been targeted in order to prevent Hezbollah moving the kidnapped Israeli soldiers deeper into Lebanon and possibly even as far as Iran, as well as to prevent the terrorist organization being re-supplied with arms from Iran and elsewhere.

Many of Hezbollah's facilities and missile launch sites are located near residential areas, such as the suburbs of southern Beirut. Terrorists hide within the civilian population and use this population as a shield. Israel's priority is to strike at the Hezbollah terrorist infrastructure that has been allowed to develop in Lebanon.

Israel has, so far, avoided initiating a major ground offensive into Lebanese territory and has barely used a fraction of the firepower available to the IDF.

Myth - "Lebanon bears no responsibility for the actions of Hezbollah."

Fact - UN Security Council Resolution 1559 of September 2004, which referred back to Resolution 425, called "upon all remaining foreign forces to withdraw from Lebanon"; "for the disbanding and disarmament of all Lebanese and non-Lebanese militias"; and supported "the extension of the control of the Government of Lebanon over all Lebanese territory".

Syria eventually complied with 1559 and removed its occupying forces. However, the Lebanese government has not disarmed Hezbollah nor has it sent its armed forces to secure southern Lebanon and the border with Israel.

In addition, Hezbollah is actually part of the Lebanese government, which contains two Hezbollah members in the Cabinet. The Lebanese government, therefore, cannot abstain from responsibility for the actions of a part of its own leadership.

Continued...
What cowards!

I hope Israel takes out Syria when their done, then Iraq and Osama since the USA cant get it right, west bank, gaza etc. :P
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Post by Anthropoid21 »

One thing to remember is that we are going to see a faaaar worse war in the not so distant future
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Re: Israel Hezbolla conflict

Post by hamin_aus »

capanno wrote:I hope Israel takes out Syria when their done, then Iraq and Osama since the USA cant get it right, west bank, gaza etc. :P
:lol:
What a n00b you are cap.

Do you think Iran and their standing army of about 400 000 men will just sit by and let that happen :?:
America will go a long way to protect Isreal, but they may not be willing to commit troops to an all-out war - which Iran has been threatening for a while now.

This all might just culminate in a very large smoking crater where the middle-east used to be....
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Post by F-ROD »

My country will remain neutral, once again
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Post by Anthropoid21 »

F-ROD wrote:My country will remain neutral, once again
And that country is... ?
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Post by Kronos »

F-ROD wrote:My country will remain neutral, once again
The problem is just that it's too close to Russia :P

When those commies decide to go over, you're in trouble.



just kidding btw
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Post by Stuart »

I heard the stupidest report on the radio today I have ever heard. 94.7 was reporting on the protestors outside the Israeli embassy in Jo'burg because "they are not happy with the action that Israel is taking." Now, I ask you: what on earth can the embassy in SA do about what is happening in the Middle East? Is it just me, or is it stupid to protest outside a building in SA for something that is happening in the Middle East?
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Post by hamin_aus »

Not really stupid. Ultimately inffectual in helping the situation, but the fact that the protest is getting media coverage is letting a few more people know about the situation.
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Post by Zell »

Thanks for those articles Cappy.

Man it pisses me off so much how the news here are making Lebanon the poor innocents, not showing ANYTHING about how Israel is suffering... The other day, ny friend regergitates **** he's seen on the news. Needless to say, I think he is a moron now.

I feel so sorry for what the Israelies have to go through, and I hope they wipe those scum off the map. If lebanon uses those dirty bombs against Israel, I hope Israel nukes the whole of the middle east.
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Post by Stuart »

lol--I don't think that there's that many people in the world who don't know--at least superficially--what's going on in Israel. But I see what you're saying: it's *informing* people of the situation out there.
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Post by capanno »

Israel FTW. As simple as that.
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Post by Road_Kill »

Israel aren't as innocent as they look. They are just as bad, they have more power, and instead of being the better, they bomb the innocent civilians. I'm not on anyone's side, cause they both have their points, and neither of them seem to be the 'biiger man'. They are like little children. They will end up destorying themselves in the end.
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Re: Israel Hezbolla conflict

Post by rustypup »

capanno wrote: Myth - "Israel's response is disproportionate."

Fact - The definition of a "disproportionate" response is a subjective one.
:lol: :lol: honest reporting indeed.....

1) The missile launches occurred *after* israel's incursion
2) the israeli's , both attcked and captured, were armed combatants, not a group of innocent civilians...

i care not what their propaganda machine spurts out around the globe, but my bs-o-meter is clanging like the dinner bell at the last supper...

both sides are guilty, and israel is trying to disguise the slaughter as a justified military action.. as opposed to the political and social requirement it has become... why not tell the truth... why hide behind this flimsiest of reasons if your actions are as transparent as they are claiming theirs to be?...

again, i would love to see the " movers stirrers" behind this hacking each other to pieces as opposed to the "unfortunate" civilians... :evil: with one or two "honest" reporters thrown in....
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Post by jee »

What blood thristy people you are... how can you wish for people to be bomed? Don't you think innocent people also live in Lebanon and the rest of the Middle East? People that just want to go on with their lives. in peace....
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Post by Zell »

Naivety...
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Post by Road_Kill »

Well if not wanting innocent people to die is naive, then so I am. I don't believe that anyone who believes the opposite of me should die, or is violent. Zell, you generalise way to much, not all of them are bombing Israel, do they deserve to be bombed?
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Post by capanno »

So you think Israel intentionally bombs civilians?
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Post by Zell »

You assume too much...

And I stick with my first claim of "naivety"...
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Post by Anakha56 »

wow as jee said you lot are so friggin bloodthirsty!

there was an article in the daily news yesterday about how israel MIGHT be using chemical weapons (phosphouros <sp> bombs) hmmm how do they justify that? according to the docters who are treating wounded the burn marks are not from normal fires. Samples have been sent off for testing. So my question is this if Israel is found to be using chemical weapons what light does it put them in? are they justified in using these weapons? even when they are against the UN International laws?

My take on this, Israel have over reacted they could have talked to try and get there men back but no they decided to play hard ball and to invade another country to try and take out a militia group not knowing (maybe they do know) that by doing this action only brings more people to the hezbolla cause.

Isnt it ironic that 2 different religion groups on these forums both support Israel in there blood letting? :roll:
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Post by lancelot »

Israel, bless you!
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Post by jee »

Road_Kill wrote:Well if not wanting innocent people to die is naive, then so I am.
agreed... although its not naivety that I see rather backward thinking...
"Integrity" and "integer" both contain a Latin root meaning "whole; complete." The root sense, then, is that people may be said to be acting with integrity when their beliefs, words, and actions have a sense of unity or wholeness.
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Post by Zell »

Anakha56 wrote: Isnt it ironic that 2 different religion groups on these forums both support Israel in there blood letting? :roll:
Why?

And that whole chemical weapons thing... pfff... making such ***** accusations.
Daily news and all the other south african "news" agencies can go rot in hell.
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Post by hamin_aus »

Zell wrote:Daily news and all the other south african "news" agencies can go rot in hell.
So if it's not pro-Isreali news you dont want to hear it :?:
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Post by Zell »

jamin_za wrote:
Zell wrote:Daily news and all the other south african "news" agencies can go rot in hell.
So if it's not pro-Isreali news you dont want to hear it :?:
No... if its pro-arab news, which it is, I don't want to hear it.
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Post by Anakha56 »

its ironic because both religions have fought each other and say the other is wrong and here you are supporting each other... well i found it ironic at least...

and you would believe other news agencies Zell? other agencies that will also blow the story way out of proportion? yes my question is theoritacal (sp) but would you still support them if they used such weapons?




btw Zell i got the W900i found a vodashop that only had 1 left...
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