Oracle releases Java SE 7

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Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by rustypup »

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oracle wrote:This release includes new features such as small language changes for improved developer productivity, a new Filesystem API, support for asynchronous I/O, a new fork/join framework for multicore performance, improved support for dynamic and script languages, updates to security, internationalization and web standards and much more.
Release notes
Features

haven't quite started crawling through the change log yet, but of interest so far would be:
  • Transparent && Arbitrarily Shaped windows
    JLayer rendering/event layer
    Multi-processor environment support
    ECC support built in, (so no need to resort to bouncycastle or similar)
Bookmarked some of the NIO changes until i get some time...

<edit>

Code: Select all

try{
}
catch(IOException|JuliusMalemaException e){}
multi-catch....

try-with-resources looks interesting... (auto-close for lazy programmers...)

Strings in switch()s... :/ can only imagine the overhead this introduces...

some further work in generic instancing...

NIO is mostly tweaks and convenience methods... nothing particularly earth shattering... much like the inclusion of binary literals....

the new GC looks as if multi-processor support cost someone their sanity :lol:
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by hamin_aus »

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Java - the programming language of choice for Ents.
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by RuadRauFlessa »

JZ.... if you can't post something constructive or give criticism in a technical thread without being cynical or abrasive please don't post at all.

Besides your comment is spawned from the views of those who refuses to even accept that each and every language has its place in the world. Java is good for some things and less so for others the same as .Net and Cobol and Fortran and Basic and C and C++ and every other language on the face of this planet. Every language has its place just as you have your place (which coincidental seems to be right here posting abrasive and unwarranted comments in a technical thread)
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by Sojourn »

Jam, to quote a forum member...

Would it save you a lot of time if I just gave up and went mad now?
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by Anakha56 »

http://developers.slashdot.org/story/11 ... lashdot%29
Java 7 Ships With Severe Bug
Posted by Soulskill on Friday July 29, @01:13PM
from the meeting-expectations dept.
Lisandro writes
"Lucid Imagination just posted an announcement about a severe bug in the recently released Java 7. Apparently some loops are mis-compiled due to errors in the HotSpot compiler optimizations, which causes programs to fail. This bug affects several Apache projects directly — Apache Lucene Core and Apache Solr have already raised an warning, noting that the bug might be present in Java 6 as well."
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by hamin_aus »

RuadRauFlessa wrote:Java is good for some things
It's fantastic if you are looking for a language that can perform really inefficiently on any platform...

The only thing keeping Java alive is the stubborn will of Sun Microsystems.

Can I ask a question of the Java guys? When is Java going to improve the look and feel of it's truly horrendous GUI tools. Using a Java-built GUI is the most painful experience a person can have. Command line is a saner option in most cases... Did they think they were being cute when they designed it? I remember in the later 90's using AWT and thinking what a P.O.S.
Then Swing came out and Java developers were having huge circle-jerks over it. I used it and was decidedly unimpressed... I haven't gone back to Java since early 2000, but by the looks of new software being developed in Java nothing has changed much... Still the same crap UI's (and slow performace).

That's not to say that no good has ever come of Java. The Java messaging System (JMS) is pretty awesome. We use and extension of it called EMS at work. It's really great. but like all things Java, the UI is built in another language :lol:

What I'm saying is Java is the red-haired stepchild of programming languages. While it does have it's place - that place is in the history books as a legacy language.
It's a hard truth, but lets face it - anything Java can do, C++ can do better and faster
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by RuadRauFlessa »

The place of Java is not what you use it for. If you use Java for a desktop application then you are seriously going in the wrong direction. Use it for websites or rather portal environments and you can't go wrong. Much like PHP I won't even attempt to use it for anything other than web development.
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by hamin_aus »

If Java's GUI wasn't so pathetic and clunky it might be worth using for the front-end of a portal app, where the portal would be accessed by clients running on multiple platforms.
But as it stands I'd rather wear the cost of some extra development time and write a front end in something else and just rework and recompile it to run on whatever platforms were needed.

As a back end I would not even consider it unless perhaps I was writing apps for mobile phones or other small devices... even then there would be other contenders.

Still, personal opinions aside - this language remains very popular - there are probably more jobs for Java developers than any other language besides the C family - so you definitely wont go hungry if you know Java... you may go insane, but you wont starve
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by rustypup »

jamin_za wrote:If Java's GUI wasn't so pathetic and clunky
hang about.. your sole gripe with the language is it isn't pretty? :lol: seriously?

i put it to you that if you're having issues with the LnF, you've never really used the platform....
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by RuadRauFlessa »

rustypup wrote:
jamin_za wrote:If Java's GUI wasn't so pathetic and clunky
hang about.. your sole gripe with the language is it isn't pretty? :lol: seriously?

i put it to you that if you're having issues with the LnF, you've never really used the platform....
+1
he is having issues with the things where java is actually stronger than other languages :P
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herp derp

Post by hamin_aus »

rustypup wrote:hang about.. your sole gripe with the language is it isn't pretty?
One of my many gripes actually. I mentioned several others but you chose to ignore them and focus on the one you felt you could best use to try and disparage me :P

Well done on all the palpable rebuttals tho. Man I had absolutely no answer to the hard hitting replies I received.

I was especially left in awe by the one where you stuck your fingers in your ear and started singing really loudly to drown out my voice.

Yes the Java UI sucks, the fact that nobody has cared to actually disagree with me on this means we are all in agreement.
I'll scurry away before this turns into a bunch of Java devs getting all happy-slappy with each other because after only 7 releases they have started to get serious about error catching.... and after only a decade or so of wide-spread multi-processor environments they have added support for it. WOW. How progressive.
Now maybe the JVM will be able to perform on par with it's cousin C++. Or maybe it will now tie up even more CPU threads and memory doing Xenu-knows-what... all while you sit and stare blankly at the ugly UI
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by RuadRauFlessa »

Oh Jamin... Jamin Jamin.... Dearest Jamin as I have stated before each language has its place. I won't use Java to develope a desktop app even to save my life as it is the wrong thing to use for a desktop app.... Now if I have to develop a web portal it is a different discussion alltogether. In websites you don't want multiple threads and as EE was their main focus for all of these years you seem to have been missing the point for you would probably have missed me saying it earlier as well. Now in a website you have multiple requests coming in all spawning a single threaded event in order to serve a single request which, where the threads by the way is handled by the web server itself and not the java portion hooked onto it :P .... And no I am not staring myself blank in the face against one gripe but that one gripe with it tells me the extent to which you have actually used the language and that does tend to explain your responses regarding it. Everyone that has not used Java in an area where it is strong constantly has this unfathomable and endless gripe with the UI... If you wanna know what the language is all about then make your next project a Java based portal and have a decent stab at it. Then we can talk again about dead languages.
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by hamin_aus »

So regal me with some of your biggest Java success stories...

I know of only a handful of apps written in Java that have been commercially successful. And I know of even less companies who develop applications in-house using Java.

Java does seem to be popular with pirates. The late (not) great Limewire was written Java.
Azureus is java - one of the most popular BT clients, but still slower than uTorrent - it's C++ cousin
Sun wrote the Oracle installer in Java (one of the main reasons I went MSSQL)
But they HAVE to keep pushing Java onto people...
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by RuadRauFlessa »

Once again jamin_za you are referring to desktop applications and that is what I am trying to tell you the whole time. Just Don't... I fear to start sounding like a broken record here. I will never as in ever...ever...ever...ever use Java for a desktop application. A Web application on the other side is something completely different and that is where java really shines. ASP.NET is a horrendous thing to be using. I'd rather be using PHP and I don't like PHP at all (fast with arrays but has too much gripe with it and no true OO).
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by hamin_aus »

When I ask you for some successful applications developed in Java you can't possibly assume I mean I just want to know about desktop applications...
Yes, I listed a few desktop apps in my examples - but that is because I only know of those. I need you to broaden my horizons. But instead you go on like a stuck record about how you hate going on like a stuck record :P

Also I'm sure calling Oracle a desktop application is going to upset the people at Sun. You might get your Java certification revoked (Yes, I remember you are Java certified :) )
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by RuadRauFlessa »

Ok How about Standardbank's Website... And The Intranet for the whole of government... Oh and ABSA's website and that of Nedbank just to name but a few of those you might have had contact with :P
jamin_za wrote:Also I'm sure calling Oracle a desktop application is going to upset the people at Sun. You might get your Java certification revoked (Yes, I remember you are Java certified :) )
Please enlighten me as to where I called Oracle a desktop application. You did make reference to an installer of Oracle which is a Desktop application written in Java by your own admission. Also you stated that you only know of the desktop apps and that I can see within your rhetoric.
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

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*sorry-I should know better*
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by hamin_aus »

So we've got all the major Banks... well renowned for how well their stuff always works. At least now I know why it takes forever to do internet banking :lol:

Government intranet sites?
Now we know why government officials are clueless idiots. Well we always knew why they were idiots, now we know why they cant effectively share information internally. well we already knew that too. Cant blame for Java for that either... still I think Java and SA government make a cute couple.
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by RuadRauFlessa »

/sigh

Dude those are but the few I mentioned. Websites these days are done either in PHP/Java/ASP given a choice I would chuck PHP right out the door as it is seriously a sorry excuse for a language as far as languages goes. It does the trick but with tons of hassles. The stuff ASP churns out is only compatible with nothing. So given a choice I would gladly go the Java route for any web development. My point is that what you base your experience on is such a small and actually irrelevant part of the platform. Why would I want to develop an installer in Java if I can use Pearl ? Why would I want a full fat desktop client for a windows platform in Java when I have .NOT ? Why would I want to write windows service applications in Java if I have .NOT ? Why would I want to restrict my users by developing a website in ASP when I can do it in Java ? Why would I frustrate myself with PHP if I have the option to do it in Java ? And why oh why would I be bothered about mutli-threading when a web application server is already handling it ? Also I have never as in ever had a problem with any of those banking sites... as in ever. They are also not the only sites running Java.
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by rustypup »

RuadRauFlessa wrote: it is the wrong thing to use for a desktop app....
utter twonk...

also, no point in feeding the troll... especially when it is abundantly evident the troll has less than perfect knowledge of the matter under discussion..

java serves as well, if not better, in a desktop environment as most other languages... not only does it do so well, it does so on multiple platforms without the need to manage bucket loads of divergent versions.... it is all pervasive in application ranging from simple sensor buttons to fridges, phones and cars...

griping about speed and footprint has been redundant since 1.4... griping about appearance is also redundant given that the LnF is swappable on the fly and in less than 5 lines of code..

java was designed form the ground up with security in mind...

java's net stack is the most robust you will meet in any given month of sundays, with python coming a relatively close second...

what hamin's actually griping about is poor programming... which has nothing at all to do with the language... you find the same in .net/c/c++... we could go on about this but doing so is pointless because it's not as entertaining as anecdotal ranting about stuff we have zero knowledge of...

can we get back to useful posts now, or are we going to lock another thread for lack of useful input?
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by hamin_aus »

rustypup wrote:java serves as well, if not better, in a desktop environment as most other languages...
Disagree
it is all pervasive in application ranging from simple sensor buttons to fridges, phones and cars...
I already said so on the last page
griping about speed and footprint has been redundant since 1.4...
Is that when you realised they were not going to do anything about it :P
griping about appearance is also redundant given that the LnF is swappable on the fly and in less than 5 lines of code..
Then why is a Java UI instantly recognisable and always difficult to navigate?
java was designed form the ground up with security in mind...
Marketing spiel? from you of all people....
java's net stack is the most robust you will meet in any given month of sundays, with python coming a relatively close second...
Lends credence to RRF's assertation that it's good for netapps rather than desktop...
what hamin's actually griping about is poor programming... which has nothing at all to do with the language... you find the same in .net/c/c++...
Just more obvious in java then? Very unforgiving language is it?
can we get back to useful posts now, or are we going to lock another thread for lack of useful input?
Are you saying RRF's answers to my questions have not been useful?
Bless his heart, he's been an absolute star these last 2 pages - and would probably have persisted had you not meddled...
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by RuadRauFlessa »

To be honest I am grinding my teeth to try and stay civil about this. Yes rusty most of the performance issues in Java can be contributed to bad programming. I had an server application in Java that processed over +-30k log files each with at least 200-300 records in less than a second. And that was still in the days of 1.4 so speed wise I have never seen the gripe about Java's performance.
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by KatrynKat »

//breathe in.... breathe out.... breathe in.... breathe out.... breathe in.... breath out....
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by RuadRauFlessa »

^^
:spam1:

On a serious note.... I am actually glad that Oracle is taking over Java. Maybe now we will see a couple more look n feels. Maybe they could even make it easier to create your own look n feel with something accessible such as CSS or something. Actually coming to think about it CSS would be awesome for it.
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Re: Oracle releases Java SE 7

Post by rustypup »

RuadRauFlessa wrote:Maybe now we will see a couple more look n feels.
i wouldn't hold my breathe - took long enough to get nimbus elevated to default package... not a bad thing... i'd rather not have the default package chock full of unused resources...

besides, it's always been as simple as falling off a bridge to roll your own...

Code: Select all

MyLookAndFeel extends BasicLookAndFeel
<..fiddle UI implementation for various components>
JLayer just adds more functionality...

<edit>
i seem to recall java supporting CSS stylesheets in component rendering... but that may be a trick of the whiskey...

<subedit>like so</subedit>
</edit>
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