Worlds most kick-@$$ aircraft!

Chat about anything and everything here!
Forum rules
The global forum rules are found here.

NOTE: posts in this section are not counted towards your total.
User avatar
hamin_aus
Forum Moderator
Posts: 18363
Joined: 28 Aug 2003, 02:00
Processor: Intel i7 3770K
Motherboard: GA-Z77X-UP4 TH
Graphics card: Galax GTX1080
Memory: 32GB G.Skill Ripjaws
Location: Where beer does flow and men chunder
Contact:

Re: Worlds most kick-@$$ aircraft!

Post by hamin_aus »

And now for some news from back home
www.strategypage.com wrote:South Africa Loses Use Of Its new Gripens

July 31, 2013: Four months after admitting that 12 of its 26 Gripen jet fighters had been placed in storage because they were too expensive to operate and there were not enough qualified pilots to fly them, South African officials admitted that the maintenance contracts for all the Gripens had expired in April. That made long term use of the Gripens dangerous. This contract was with a reliable, and expensive, South African firm (Denel). The maintenance contracts pay for ongoing support for the aircraft to include updates and warnings on problems other users have encountered, as well as access to manufacturer engineers and maintenance experts. Aircraft become more dangerous to operate (if they operate at all) without regular maintenance and these maintenance contracts are a critical part of that. Some South African politicians are now calling for the Gripens to be sold, as there is not likely to be sufficient money to operate them and retain qualified pilots.

Currently, only about half of the remaining 14 Gripens are flyable and there are only six qualified Gripen pilots. Corruption, shrinking defense budgets, and political pressure to find more black combat pilots and technical personnel has led to the South African Air Force having fewer operational aircraft. All this has been going on for over a decade.

For example, back in 2009, the South African Air Force stopped automatically releasing data on how many hours combat pilots flew for training. When the numbers were finally obtained, it was discovered that in 2008, fighter pilots were in the air for 325 hours (less than two hours a month per pilot). In contrast, pilots on VIP flights (carrying politicians and government officials) were in the air for 1,932 hours. There are about fifty transports and 80 helicopters in the air force at the time, and that number has continued to shrink.

In 2009, the air force had only twenty fighter pilots and only nine Gripen fighters. The remaining 17 were delivered by 2012. In 2008, the last of the 66 Cheetah fighters (rebuilt French Mirage IIIs) were retired. In 2008, the last full year that Cheetahs were operational, fighter pilots got 2,084 hours in the air and the year before that it was 2,448 hours. It's believed that only six of those twenty fighter pilots were competent to handle these aircraft in combat. Most competent pilots have left the air force because of the lack of flying hours. Many of the pilots remaining got in under a quota system that attempts to add more racial diversity to the air force.

Not surprisingly, many South Africans believe that the South African Air Force (SAAF) has been falling apart for years. The most obvious evidence of this is the decrepit state of aging buildings, runways, and aircraft. But the biggest problem is getting, and keeping, technical people. This is complicated by a government program to integrate previously all white institutions. This has been most difficult in areas that require a lot of technical training and education. Like pilots and aircraft maintainers.

The government has set a racial goal for SAAF pilots and wants them to be 75 percent black and 25 percent white. A lack of qualified black air force personnel means that this goal has still not been met. The morale problem started getting a lot worse back in 2005, when the three top rated graduates of pilot training school, who would normally go on to fly fighters, were told that, because they were white, they would instead fly helicopters or transports. Three less qualified black pilots would go on to fly fighters. When commanders noted the morale problem, and public outcry, they declared that it was no longer the policy to send the best pilots to fighters but to spread the best pilots around to all flying communities.

The problem here is that flying fighters is the technically most demanding job for pilots, and the best pilots only stay in the SAAF to fly fighters. If they wanted to fly helicopters or transports they could make more money, and fly more often, as civilian pilots. So the SAAF is ending up with less competent fighter pilots (which ultimately results in more accidents) and fewer, and less capable, helicopter and transport pilots as well. Since the SAAF pilots are currently selected more for their race than for their ability, the morale of most pilots will remain quite low.

A similar situation occurs in other technical specialties, like maintaining the aircraft. Fewer whites are enlisting for these jobs, and more existing techs are quitting for civilian jobs. There is also pressure on civilian airlines to integrate, but the pressure is not as great because politicians fly those airliners and want the highest quality pilots and maintainers for those aircraft.

Even with the current situation it won't be easy getting that many black pilots, as blacks with the skills to be pilots tend to prefer better paying civilian jobs. And there aren't many black pilots to begin with. In the long run, this won't mean much, beyond a higher accident rate for military aircraft and some lost aircraft. This has been the case in other African countries where most, or all, air force pilots are black. South Africa has no enemies in its neighborhood and little likelihood that the SAAF would have to go to war.

South Africa is also fortunate that it has a free press. Many other nations (especially in Africa) have in the past faced similar problems with jet fighters. But these countries are usually dictatorships so details of why the jet fighters don’t fly much (or even reports that they don’t fly much) don’t get reported. But after the dictatorship falls, as they all eventually do, the sad tales of the aircraft that were too expensive to operate emerges.
Brings us back to the old why does SA even need fighter planes at this point argument.
At this point money would be better spent on aircraft that are actually useful to a developing country, like cargo planes, helicopters and small fixed wing scout planes. SA is never going to have to fight one of it's neighbors in the skies.
And a few well placed static and mobile SAM's could protect from the odd UFO well enough.
Image
Anakha56
Forum Administrator
Posts: 22136
Joined: 14 Jun 2004, 02:00
Processor: Ryzen 1700K
Motherboard: Asus X370
Graphics card: Asus 1060 Strix
Memory: 16GB RAM
Location: Where Google says

Re: Worlds most kick-@$$ aircraft!

Post by Anakha56 »

Hey USA we have free "oil" for the taking... :whistle:
JUSTICE, n A commodity which is a more or less adulterated condition the State sells to the citizen as a reward for his allegiance, taxes and personal service.
Hman
Registered User
Posts: 28520
Joined: 06 Oct 2003, 02:00
Processor: Intel i5 650
Motherboard: Asus P7H55-M LX
Graphics card: Gigabyte 7850 2GB OC
Memory: 8GB Kingston DDR3
Location: In my skin
Contact:

Re: Worlds most kick-@$$ aircraft!

Post by Hman »

Hey China, we rove you!
"Every thinking man is a drinking man."


Member of the Barberton Tigers
Anakha56
Forum Administrator
Posts: 22136
Joined: 14 Jun 2004, 02:00
Processor: Ryzen 1700K
Motherboard: Asus X370
Graphics card: Asus 1060 Strix
Memory: 16GB RAM
Location: Where Google says

Re: Worlds most kick-@$$ aircraft!

Post by Anakha56 »

http://sploid.gizmodo.com/russias-new-s ... @jesusdiaz
Newly captured photo shows Russia's new badass shark stealth fighter

A new photo captured by Artyom Anikeev shows Russia's new Sukhoi T-50 stealth fighter—America's F-22 Raptor's nemesis. According to The Aviationist, its new camouflage—inspired by a typical white tip Red Sea's shark—will make it look "as a rhomboidal shaped aircraft, smaller than the actual airplane" from a distance.

The Sukhoi T-50 is the prototype of the PAK FA, the fifth generation fighter that will replace the MiG-29 and Su-27.

The dark shape actually looks like the concept Aleksander Dultsev. Recent reports indicate that the T-50 could match and outperform both the F-22 Raptor and the F-35 Lightning II.
Image
JUSTICE, n A commodity which is a more or less adulterated condition the State sells to the citizen as a reward for his allegiance, taxes and personal service.
User avatar
hamin_aus
Forum Moderator
Posts: 18363
Joined: 28 Aug 2003, 02:00
Processor: Intel i7 3770K
Motherboard: GA-Z77X-UP4 TH
Graphics card: Galax GTX1080
Memory: 32GB G.Skill Ripjaws
Location: Where beer does flow and men chunder
Contact:

Re: Worlds most kick-@$$ aircraft!

Post by hamin_aus »

No doubt it will outperform the F-35, most 4.5 gen fighters outperform it currently. All that aircraft has in its favour is tech. In a WVR dogfight against anything modern it will likely be toast.

The T-50 looks like a cheapish F-22 knock-off.
The engine cowlings are more pronounced and the wings look to have a smaller angle which will mean better performance at high speeds (if the engines are as good as the ones on the Raptor)
It's colouring isn't a plus in my book, that paint doesn't look to be radar absorbing or dispersing - I'm no expert tho.

The ruskies still look to be building epic dog fighters, while the yanks churn our so-so planes like the Lightning and shove hi-tech ECM and weapons systems in there hoping BVR ability will mitigate a lack of manoeuvrability.

But historically most A2A kills are WVR, even recent wars like Desert Storm and Kosovo were predominantly WVR so unless the yanks are confidant they can shoot at targets sight-unseen (which so far they haven't been) they may be in for a surprise...

I think the PAK-FA is a better attempt at copying the Raptor than the Chinese, who actually put canards on the front of theirs because it was unstable during low speed manoeuvring, probably due to poor avionics...
Image
User avatar
hamin_aus
Forum Moderator
Posts: 18363
Joined: 28 Aug 2003, 02:00
Processor: Intel i7 3770K
Motherboard: GA-Z77X-UP4 TH
Graphics card: Galax GTX1080
Memory: 32GB G.Skill Ripjaws
Location: Where beer does flow and men chunder
Contact:

Re: Worlds most kick-@$$ aircraft!

Post by hamin_aus »

news.yahoo.com wrote:Brazil picks Sweden's Gripen for its air force

Brasília (AFP) - Sweden's Saab edged out French and US rivals to win a multi-billion-dollar contract to supply Brazil's air force with 36 new fighter jets, Defense Minister Celso Amorim said Wednesday.

Saab's Gripen NG was in competition with the Rafale made by France's Dassault company and US aviation giant Boeing's F/A-18 fighter for the long-deferred FX-2 air force replacement program

"After analyzing all the facts, President Dilma Rousseff directed me to inform that the winner of the contract for the acquisition of the 36 fighter jets for the Brazilian Air Force is the Swedish Gripen NG," Amorim told a press conference.

He put the actual value of the contract, earlier estimated at $5 billion, at $4.5 billion as Saab offered the cheapest price.

"We are a peaceful country, but we will not remain defenseless," Rousseff said on the presidential palace's blog.

"It is important to realize that a country the size of Brazil must be ready to protect its citizens, its resources, its sovereignty.(…) We must be ready to deal with any threat," she added,

The announcement came after more than 10 years of discussions and repeated delays due to budgetary constraints.

It came as a surprise, as experts were forecasting a Dassault-Boeing duel.

Amorim said the Gripen, a state-of-the-art, multi-role fighter, got the nod based on performance, assurances of full technology transfer and overall costs.

The Swedish aircraft, which was favored by the air force brass, is capable of performing an extensive range of air-to-air, air-to-surface and reconnaissance missions.

View galleryBrazilian Defense Minister Celso Amorim (L) speaks …
Brazilian Defense Minister Celso Amorim (L) speaks next to Air Force Commander Juniti Saito during a …
It can carry up to 6.5 tons of armament and equipment.

Munitions include various missiles, laser-guided bombs, and a single 27 mm Mauser BK-27 cannon.

The Gripen is in use in the air forces of Britain, South Africa, the Czech Republic, Thailand and Hungary.

Rousseff had postponed a decision on the FX-2 replacement contract in early 2011 for budgetary reasons but air force chiefs made it clear that it was an urgent matter.

The air force said the new fighter aircraft were needed to maintain an adequate air defense as it is to retire its 12 Mirage jets in late December.

Brazil bought the refurbished Mirage 2000 C/Bs from France in 2005 for $80 million to fly for five years.

A key requirement for the sale was technology transfers so that the planes can be assembled in this country and give a boost to the domestic defense industry.

Amorim said negotiations with Saab would take 10-12 months, with the signing of the contract expected at the end of next year and delivery of the first aircraft 48 months later.

The defense minister said Brazil's top plane maker Embraer "will benefit greatly" from the deal.

The G1 news website quoted Air Force spokesman Marcelo Damasceno as saying the Gripen jets "will meet the operational needs of the Air Force for the next 30 years."

Wednesday's announcement was a major blow for Dassault which has so far failed to export the Rafale.

French President François Hollande personally lobbied for Dassault's plane during a state visit to Brazil last week.

Brazilian press reports said Rousseff was leaning toward the F/A-18 but recent disclosures of extensive US cyberspying on Brazil dashed Boeing's hopes.

In 2009, then president Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva had expressed a preference for the Rafale but later backtracked and left the choice to his successor Dilma Rousseff.

A source close to Dassault in Paris said the Rafale was the most expensive among the three aircraft in contention.

"There is a prototype of the Gripen NG, which already has 300 hours of flight," said Brazilian Air Force Commander Juniti Saito.

"We are going to develop the plant jointly with Sweden. with Saab, to have 100 percent of the plane's intellectual property," he added.

"Within the Air Force, the Gripen was always seen as the favorite because, even though it has many US-made components, it is a project that will be developed jointly with Brazil," the daily O Estado de Sao Paulo said.

Image
Hopefully the Brazzers will get more use out of theirs than we do... AFAIK we still dont have any pilots trained to fly ours.
Image
Hman
Registered User
Posts: 28520
Joined: 06 Oct 2003, 02:00
Processor: Intel i5 650
Motherboard: Asus P7H55-M LX
Graphics card: Gigabyte 7850 2GB OC
Memory: 8GB Kingston DDR3
Location: In my skin
Contact:

Re: Worlds most kick-@$$ aircraft!

Post by Hman »

hamin_aus wrote:The Gripen is in use in the air forces of Britain, the Czech Republic, Thailand and Hungary. And disused in the air force of South Africa.
Fixed
"Every thinking man is a drinking man."


Member of the Barberton Tigers
Post Reply